What Can I Do?

[zofo61]

I have an RSM settup on my car and I want tot go faster. Please give me your suggestions as I have not any help from RSM unless I go to Canada and pay alot more. Common guys you can do it !!

[Manitcor]

RE: What Can I Do?

theres lots you can do, but to help you at all more information about your current setup is neccassary

which stage RSM kit are you running?
how big are your injectors?
are you capable of tuning your PCM yourself or have access to someone who can?
is your setup intercooled?
how many pounds of boost are you pushing with your current pulley?
what size pulley?
I assume your running a stock cam profile yes?
when your ported your heads did you upgrade any of the valvetrain at all?

Also what have you done in the way of transmission mods? Depending on which stage CSC kit your running you may already be pushing your luck with a stock t65.

[zofo61]

Hey Manticor
I also know u from the 2000monteCarlo.com site and you r very informed

The RSM kit I am running is the stage 1 Supercharger 8lbs boost with the ported heads and TB and UIM, LIM

Stock Injectors

No PCM Tuning as yet , however I am Talking with DHP

No Intercooler

Pully that came with kit

Stock Cam

I dont Know what the heads came with other than porting

Thanks for any help you might have

[Manitcor]

considering how RSM tries to give you as little as possible while raping you for as much as possible (sorry but its true) Im betting its just mild port work and rebuild with stock parts. Maybe some stiffer springs.

8lbs of boost on a stock 3400 is going to put you in the territory of 260hp at the crank. Im not sure how agressive torque managment is on the LS pcm so you may be already coming close to beating up that trans a bit espically on the 1-2 shift.

Most l67 guys start to see stock t65 faliure after some time north of 280-300hp. So you need to start thinking now about your transmission before going much further powerwise.

As for power a DHP tune may be in your favor, you are defintly going to need larger injectors for any further modifcation as your stock 22.5lb injectors are already going to be close to thier limit. When you do get the chance to get a scan on a powertuner or a tech 2 be sure to take a careful look at your pulse width. You may already be having some performance degradation there.

After improving your fueling i would say shoot for some headers and an exhaust to go with it combined with a custom cam and perhaps some stiffer valve springs (if you dont have them already). You are already pushing air in really well so you want to work on pushing air out better. With a cam, headers, and better fueling I would say you will easily see north of 300hp crank.

You will also likely need to upgrade your fuel pump, im not sure which pump the 6th gen LS has but I have a feeling it may not provide enough fuel for much more power either and certinaly if your looking to break 300.

An intercooler would be a good idea too (though not required unless you go for more boost), not just for power but the overall health of the CSC and engine, espically considering your in florida. With a CSC you can use a standard FMIC for a turbo application.

Beyond that you can pontienally get a smaller pulley to produce a higher amount of boost. On average for every 1psi increase you should net about 10hp however I think this may be lower for a CSC since you o have parasitic loss that a turbo does not suffer from.

First and formost, get on that tranny, it would suck to get your engine modded to make north of 300hp only to have your trans take a dump shortly thereafter.

[Hemet8]

Say, got any times with that set-up?? I have not ever seen any posted from people with RSM's stuff. I agree with Manticor 100% on the tranny upgrade. I'm actually surprized that it has held up this long.

[zofo61]

Thanks for your input.....as far as headers and hiflo cat and pipeing...thats already done and with the MSD ignition I am already 320+ on HP. The tranny surprisingly is doing real well but I have already contacted ZZP in Michigan and when I go to the meet in April I am going to have their HD upgrade.....higher stall speed torque converter and going to a lower final gear ratio plus a few more tweeks.

I guess the intercooler would help alot but the plumbing its going to be a bitch considering the local of the CSC, but doable with a little loss in boost due to the bends.

Yes its true getting info out of Neson and Zsolt at RSM is difficult but considering the money paid and the performance gained I really cant complain that much. The problem is where to go from there. Problem with a smaller pully is the fuel need and PCM tuning for bigger pump and injectors. The RSM set-up has a unique pully that can only come from RSM and I dont think they will sell it separate from their stage two setup which include the pulley injectors , pump, and a second MSD box plus PCM tuning for about 2000.00 more. Too much and I cant do another 10 days in CAnada.

I am getting the tranny taken care of. I reallly dont have the expertise in tuning PCMS even if I had the programmer. Maybe thats where people like you come in.

The folks at DHP have a PC setup that can do anything you want, trouble is what do I need. Interms I can simply understand. This tech part is what f*cks with us old school guys.

A cam setup would be great if I knew whats in the heads to begin with. I am in contact with Nelson at RSM and hopefully he will provide that info so I can order a setup based on the present config.

This car is a daily driver and will NEVER be a strip car, but it really is fun blowing away cars that think it just an LS with mufflers.

Keep up the ideas cause I need all the help I can get at this point.

[Manitcor]

just curious, how do you know your making 320hp with your current setup? is that what they told you it would make? is that what it dynoed at?

on a stock pump and stock injectors you cant push enough fuel into the combustion chamber to make that kind of power. I know the pushrod 660s respond well to boost so I wouldnt be surprised to see close to 300hp on 8psi. I would be real intrested if thats a verified number.

ZZP and certified will make a good trans for you. Another option which may be a bit less of a drive is Dynotech Performance. They are based in NJ and do alot of the guys on the east cost.

[Syn]

Thanks for your input.....as far as headers and hiflo cat and pipeing...thats already done and with the MSD ignition I am already 320+ on HP. The tranny surprisingly is doing real well but I have already contacted ZZP in Michigan and when I go to the meet in April I am going to have their HD upgrade.....higher stall speed torque converter and going to a lower final gear ratio plus a few more tweeks.

I guess the intercooler would help alot but the plumbing its going to be a bitch considering the local of the CSC, but doable with a little loss in boost due to the bends.

Yes its true getting info out of Neson and Zsolt at RSM is difficult at best but considering the money paid and the performance gained I really cant complain that much. The problem is where to go from there. Problem with a smaller pully is the fuel need and PCM tuning for bigger pump and injectors. The RSM set-up has a unique pully that can only come from RSM and I dont think they will sell it separate from their stage two setup which include the pulley injectors , pump, and a second MSD box plus PCM tuning for about 2000.00 more. Too much and I cant do another 10 days in CAnada.

I am getting the tranny taken care of. I reallly dont have the expertise in tuning PCMS even if I had the programmer. Maybe thats where people like you come in.

The folks at DHP have a PC setup that can do anything you want, trouble is what do I need. Interms I can simply understand. This tech part is what f*cks with us old school guys.

A cam setup would be great if I knew whats in the heads to begin with. I am in contact with Nelson at RSM and hopefully he will provide that info so I can order a setup based on the present config.

This car is a daily driver and will NEVER be a strip car, but it really is fun blowing away cars that think it just an LS with mufflers.

Keep up the ideas cause I need all the help I can get at this point.

where in mich is zzp?
so you running stock fuel system?
you trying to get a custom chip burned pretty much huh?
ever look into other stand alone ecu's? like Megasquirt?

[zofo61]

They are in Grand Rapids and I am looking at all of the possibilities for sure:

Stock fuel system with RSM PCM Tweaks....yes

[Syn]

They are in Grand Rapids and I am looking at all of the possibilities for sure:

Stock fuel system with RSM PCM Tweaks....yes

well idk if you wanted to try this for fuel but some people run a rrfpr and a new pump and get enough fuel taht way, but their turbo i never delt with s/c's. but i am sure its still the same

[Manitcor]

the thing is, stock injectors are only 22.5lb. Injectors with that flow rate are going to run out of breath on a stock fuel pump which only provides 45psi. At that rate you should be loosing pulse width not much past 250hp. Envoiorment and tuning will take you so far but there is no magic PCM tuning that is going to make a 22.5lb injector push as much fuel as a 42.5lb injector on a 45psi fuel system. And thats what you would need to be makng that kind of power.

Im not trying to bash your setup at all zofo im just trying to figure out whats really going on here. From what Im seeing you should technically be on the edge of what your current fuel setup is capable of and I dont see anyway you can be making 320.

Besides that DHP is prob going to be your best bet as far as tuning is concered. Its the easiest to work with as you dont need to wire in addational independant systems. To be honest the MSD ignition box they put on your car isint really neccassary either.

[zofo61]

No....thats Ok Manitcor ....thats what I need is honesty at this point. I respect your opinion and thats why I am using these forums. Not to boast but to learn from people like yourself and others on the boards.

I am seriosly going to get the DHP system that is laptop based. I also am on the Tranny HD upgrades. I guess at this point I need to find out where(other than GM) I get good quality injectors.......what specs.........and where and what to get as far as fuel pumps and or regulator systems. I am certain I need to get that lined up BEFORE I purchase the DHP PCM Programs.

Other than the UIM removal what is involved in the injector and pump swap.

I have emailed Nelson at RSM for the stage 2 pully and the head specs.

If the heads turn out to be what you stated they prbably are.......what is the best STREET cam setup on those heads provided this is a daily drive. I know you can get stupid with variose valve and rocker setups....but there has to be a more radical Cam setup that uses the current valve and rockers on the heads?

Sorry but this is new but exciting.........I probably could have done better for the Monies I paid, but live and learn from guys on the forum.

Thanks for your time and hopefully we can meet at one of the various meets around the country.

The MSD BTW was put in due to candle effects post install. The port on the head is not mild but a bit too much for the current stage one setup. That much I know for sure as I was there during the troubleshooting. It wasnt a preignition issue bet rather the litteral blowout of spark. WE closed the gap and it got alot better, but everything smoothed out when the MSD box was put in.

Anyway thanks for your input as always and cant wait to hear more of your suggestions. I learn more everyday

[Manitcor]

im still a bit confused as to why an MSD iginiton box was neccassary, the stock ignition system is more than powerful enough to create spark under boosted conditions. IIRC the L67 uses the same ignition module and coils as we do and ZZP uses the stock ignition system on all thier applcations. The only reason I can think of as to why you would use that box is due to the lack of computer tuning. Since they couldnt/wouldnt adjust your timing and fuel trim to account for boost they had to make a more powerful spark to make up for the spark happening at the wrong time for your setup.

As for the cam, did RSM provide you with any flow data on the heads? Did the flow bench them at all? Cammotion would be my choice for a custom boosted cam. They can actually reccomened a cam profile for you based on your head flow, valve train components and desired power band.

As for fuel your first step is to go for 42.5lb injectors found in the GTP. You would need to change the connectors on the injector harness to get them to work. Also upgrade your fuel pump to the Walboro pump along with the wiring to the pump so it has plenty of juice to pump fuel under high load. With 42.5lb injectors you should be good to about 350hp. After that you need larger injectors (60lb prefferably). However the issue with anything larger than 42.5 is that the injectors are taller than stock. While this isnt an issue for the 90* guys because thier fuel rail sits out side the intake. Our injectors sit under the plenum so there will be a clearance issue. Im thinking of making a spacer for the plenum to gain another 1" or so in space however you are also changing the angle of the injector with a taller injector. A few people have mentioned that changing the angle of the nozzle will result in a less than optimum air/fuel mixture.

As a first step, if you can get some dyno time at one of your local shops. Get a decent power measuement of you car. Also get some 1/4 mile track runs. Not so much for bragging rights but with a combination of dyno charts and trap speeds you will have a more accurate picture of where you are at currently power-wise. This will also be useful when you do the next round of mods so you can see the power gain when you dyno and track run after the mods. Dyno time is also going to be essential to getting the best tune possible out of your PCM once you upgrade everything.

[zofo61]

I did not get any flow specs for the heads. Actuall I got no specs on anything for that matter.Guess it was my nievete' in this matter.

I am now trying to get those numbers. Yes I do need a baseline dyno and that will be forthcomming.

This is the type of info I need to really get serious on the next round of mods and I thank you for your input ....it is so helpful.

Guess I will start with the fuel procurment needs and work on the cam when I get the info from RSM.

Thanks again

Chris

[zofo61]

Here is the head info that you need. CFM 620. Stock valve size %15 larger valve bowl.

What does this mean for me and a cam settup?