3100 lower intake leaking, tips needed.

[cardude225]

Coolant In Oil - AGAIN

OK people I have a 1996 Olds Ciera with 3.1.

I bought the car at 46k, immediately noticed that coolant was leaking into the oil (yes, no joke) and oil leaking into the coolant, and I band aided it until 67k (ran cooling fan constantly, changed oil lots, etc) when finally all hell broke loose and the coolant basically dumped into the oil. I finally payed $800 at a local GM dealer and they fixed the problem. I thought I was done.

It is now 43k later and I am seeing evidence of the same problem again. I am ready to go bolistic.

Would I be better served discussing this in another secion of this forum, or can we talk about it right here (as I have 3.1 not 3100)?

For anyone wondering, since the problem first happened in '04, I started keeping a very detailed blog. It is located here:
http://consumerhelpline-org.dyndns.org/co/gm/

I am about to ram a pushrod up the local GM dealer's tailpipe so any thoughts on this would be appreciated.

I also have in my possession the actual service bulletin 03-06-01-010 but I would also like to get my hands on the revised bulletin, 03-06-01-010B.

Thank you all. God Bless America.

[bszopi]

Possibly this TSB? http://60degreev6.com/Articles/Pushr...SB14-3x00.html

[dodgerunner]

Well cardude225 that is about when I replaced mine, was 2003 or 2004. They made it about 28K before it started to leak. I had used the Felpro gaskets and the book torque values which have all changed.

Yes this seems to be a common problem with these engine.

The new dealer gaskets I just installed came with a slip specifiying that all the bolts be torqued to 10ft/lb and replaces all prev. torque values. (for the 3100)

I sure hope these last a lot longer than the last ones.

[cardude225]

Thanks for that TSB.

The one thing add about all of this is that nowhere on either TSB does it list my vehicle - 1996 Oldsmobile Ciera. But I do have the 3.1. And they did replace the lower intake gasket 3 years ago which solved the problem.

Can anybody shed some light on THIS?

When I call my dealer to give them the "push rod treatment" i'm afraid they're going to tell me that my car isn't listed on the TSBs and so go jump in the lake. HELP

Thanks

[bszopi]

Your engine is an L82, whereas the 3.1L listed on the TSB is an LG8. But, both engine use basically the exact same lower gasket, so I have never understood why none of the L82s (93-99 3.1L) are listed on that TSB.

[cardude225]

Absolutely rediculous. I tell you what, I'm going to do my damndest not to pay for this repair again.

[Rhedalert]

is the oil milky again, or just the evicence on the oil cap? I've had some light colored sludge show up on the cap, when the engine was fine. Sometimes it just happens, especially if the engine isn't driven for long periods of time to allow moisture to boil out of the oil. And the sludge in the coolant resevoir could be from GM's lovely sealant goo that the dealer may have re-added as a failsafe (GM typically adds a little at the factory) All Deathcool equipped cars I see will have some kind of buildup in the resevoir.

[cardude225]

I've got a trace amount of milky substance underneath the oil cap. But what really gave it away was when i changed the oil, I noticed "seeds" of water in the oil drain pan as I poured it into the storage jug. Not a lot, but definitely more then i have ever seen. Car is driven daily 45 miles a day.

I stopped using Dexcool after the last lower intake gasket replacement 3 years ago. Have used only green Prestone since then. Coolant recovery tank is progressively getting "oilier". First repair was at 67kmi. Cooling system was flushed 68kmi and 92kmi. Im at 110kmi.

I don't think i'm at a catastrophic stage yet. But I know it's coming.

I cannot believe my engine is not included on the TSBs. Because if it was, I believe I would have a lot of leverage in getting this job done again for less than retail. I don't get it.

[tractorman]

It isn't good to run an engine with ANY amount of coolant in the oil. I'd suggest that you get it fixed right away... even a little coolant can do a number on bearings.

If that isn't an option... you'd do well to put some of those GM stopleak tablets into the cooling system. I wouldn't rely on them as a long-term fix... but I've seen them work wonders on those stupid plastic gaskets.

[cardude225]

I have to revise something I stated a few days ago.

I stated that I have a 3.1. But what is actually stamped on the intake of the eng is "3100 SFI V6"


I don't know if this makes a difference or not. I though I read somewhere that 3.1 does not equal 3100.

I still don't understand why my car, 1996 Oldsmobile Ciera, is not on the TSBs. Someone suggested it may be because Oldsmobile stopped producing cars, but I checked the TSB and there is an Oldsmobile on it. The thing is, they stopped producing Ciera's in 1996. Maybe that is why they decided not to include my car?

In recent days I haven't noticed ANY trace of milky sludge underneath my oil cap. But I know it is coming.

Thanks everybody so far for all of your responses.

[bszopi]

I already explained it to you above. The only engine listed in the TSB (don't ask me why) are 99+ 3100s (LG8 ) and all 3400s (LA1). But the same basic gasket design was used in all of the engines (from when they started production in 93).

[cardude225]

BS, I understand what you already told me. However, that explanation is not sufficient.

I am determined to find out *why*. Apparently no one here knows. I've already begun digging in to GM. We'll see where that gets me. And I will surely let you all know if I find out anything significant.

Thanks.

[Rhedalert]

Also take into consideration that the engines with Deathcool are more prone to having intake gasket leaks as well. So even though the early '93-98 3100 (L82) used the same gaskets as the newer engines, there is less occurrence of failure since '93-95 ones used the green coolant. GM probably grouped the engine together based on amount of incidents per vehicle per year. If not many '96 Cieras came in for bad gaskets, they'll do the bean-counter move and not include it. This is the case with many things GM addresses.

[cardude225]

Brian - very helpful. Thank you.

[skooterbum]

advice for another just joining in ??

hi all, i have a 96 olds cutlass with the 3.1 v6. 105,000 miles. it is leaking coolant from either the head gasket or the intake. due to the placement of the leak it is hard to tell where exactly. i have read through this entire post and am wondering if there is anything i can do to have the local dealer take care of this ?? or am i on my own. i have some physical dissabilities that will make it extremely hard as well as painful to try this repair myself !! the leak is worse when the engine is cold. as it warms up it closes off the leak. another reason i am questioning the head gasket. it sometimes runs like crap and sometimes runs great. if i step on the gas in park it cuts out at 4,000rpm when running good. when running bad i have to floor the damn thing to get it to move.