NA Gen IIs Can Haul A$$ Too

[bracketracer]

Well folks, even though we haven't been able to complete all the tuning to maximize my NA Gen II race engine, it is finally coming into it's own. I had been mildly disappointed with my early results because I assumed I would be running 14s right away, and I wasn't. I really should have realized that the car is now very different than with the tired old stock motor, and I was doing to need to "relearn" to race it. On the 5th pass with the new motor, I managed a 15.038 @ 89.82 (2.091 60 ft, 6.188 330 ft, 9.584@72.93 1/8, & 12.527 1000 ft), which I was pretty pleased with. Especially since the air was not very good that day, with Density Altitude of 2574' (85 degrees, 50% humidity, 29.34 barometer). This weekend I decided that I really needed to see a 14, and even if it was only 14.999, and I would be happy. I started off ever so close on my second time run, 15.020 @ 90.35 (2.097 60 ft, 6.194 330 ft, 9.579@73.16 1/8, & 12.511 1000 ft), and I backed it up in eliminations with a 15.028 @ 89.65 (2.024 60 ft, 6.153 330 ft, 9.549@74.04 1/8, & 12.513 1000 ft). The next round of eliminations almost did it. I had a best ever 1.989 60 ft, 6.090 330 ft, 9.492@72.83 1/8, & 12.447 1000, however I was far enough ahead of my opponent at the traps that I had to stab the brakes really hard to avoid breaking out, and ended up with a 15.061 @ only 79.51 (down 11 mph from normal). If I had stayed on the gas, I estimate I would have run about 14.96, but I would have lost the race. That's how it goes in bracket racing! I ended the night losing in the semis with 6 runs between 15.020 & 15.131, but no 14 second pass. I had high hopes for this morning, since the air was better (DA yesterday was between 1602 & 1899, today it started a bit lower), and my Sunbird didn't let me down. The first time run I managed a good 2.021 60 ft, 6.091 330 ft, 9.462 @ 74.28, & 12.424 1000 ft, for a 14.937 @ 89.88 for my first 14 ever, and I was thrilled. I didn't want to be greedy and hope for more, but every racer does, right? Round 1 of eliminations was great and horrible. Horrible because I lost by breakout, but great for the result. I had a new best 60 ft of 1.973, 6.022 330 ft, 9.392 @ 73.43 1/8, and 12.323 1000. As I hit the traps I was ahead again, and I had to hit the brakes again. This bumped my mph down to 82.97 (down about 7 mph from normal), but I still had a 14.869 ET! If I had completed this run, the car should have run about 14.83! Now I can't wait to get more of the tuning done, better air, and some more miles on the motor (less than 1200 now), and I'm sure even better things will come. Then it's time to throw on the headers, re-tune, and here come some low 14s!

[Superdave]

One of these days i'm going to pick up a 3.1 5 speed base model Jbody and push a gen2 engine to the limit.. i have some insanely ported gen2 heads sitting in the garage and a LIM that i started to modify the runners on...

Nice times though!

iirc the fastest all motor Gen 2 engine/Jbody was a 14.7x several years ago... you've almost got Franz beat.

[1988GTU]

One of these days i'm going to pick up a 3.1 5 speed base model Jbody and push a gen2 engine to the limit.. i have some insanely ported gen2 heads sitting in the garage and a LIM that i started to modify the runners on...

Nice times though!

iirc the fastest all motor Gen 2 engine/Jbody was a 14.7x several years ago... you've almost got Franz beat.

Are you talking about doing it n/a or f/i? Cause I am already working on the f/i one.

[Superdave]

Are you talking about doing it n/a or f/i? Cause I am already working on the f/i one.

N/A all the way...

Boost is cheating in my book, although i'm not ruling it out for next year.

[bracketracer]

Thanks guys. I will have to keep everyone informed on progress over the remainder of the season. Superdave, I am tossing around the idea of trying to make one last trip for the year to Cordova (I love that place), and to see if Josh will join me. Maybe we can meet up with you and some of the others from that neck of the woods for a "mini meet" at a test-n-tune.

[OldSkoolGP]

That would be cool. Joe's got a goal to chase now, and I've still got my 13.9x goal. Cordova in October, I'd hit it!

[1QUICKHATCH]

congrats on cracking the 14's!

One of these days i'm going to pick up a 3.1 5 speed base model Jbody and push a gen2 engine to the limit.. i have some insanely ported gen2 heads sitting in the garage and a LIM that i started to modify the runners on...

Nice times though!

iirc the fastest all motor Gen 2 engine/Jbody was a 14.7x several years ago... you've almost got Franz beat.

don't forget about jjz24 his best was a 14.00 !

[bracketracer]

Thanks 1QUICKHATCH! Now I really need to crack the 14.75 barrier thru the stock manifolds and downpipe. I think that will be very possible with tuning and better air, maybe even 14.50. Then I will bring on the headers!

Do you know anything about what jjz24 was running to get an NA Gen II down to 14.00? Just curious.

Superdave, I looked at Cordova's schedule, and I see that Sunday, October 12 is the rain date for BOP Day. Can you find out if the track would be open that day for Test-N-Tune if BOP goes on on Saturday, October 11? That date would work out really well for a road/race trip. Josh, how does that day look for you? It would also be great to see other 60degree folks there too.

[1QUICKHATCH]

you should be able to get that 14.75 with a little more work!

jjz24 had alot of head work, alot of lower intake work and a cam (thinking lunati)
stock TB, stock exhaust manifolds and stock short block other than the cam. I think that the slicks and suspension helped too!

I am going to try to shoot for the 14's with my lumina next year, because as far as I know it has not been done in a N/A 3.1mpfi w-body! looking to get low 16's out of it this year though...

[bracketracer]

Thanks for the info on jjz24. I too have alot of head work, courtesy of Ben (ported & polished, LS6 springs, 3500 valves, 1.52:1 Comp Cams roller rockers), and my manifolds were both ported & polished by him as well. I have a 62mm TB though. I do still have the stock exhaust manifolds, crossover, & downpipe for now, leading into a 2.5" custom exhaust, no cat, and Walker Turbo muffler. My short block is overbored .060" (1.5 mm), I have higher compression hypereutectic Silvolite pistons, and stock rods and crank, but everything was balanced to 8000 rpm. I have a Crane 272 cam as well. I am running on Drag Radials with a stock suspension. I may have to do something about the tired stock suspension if getting power to the ground becomes tougher though. I am very optimistic about tuning and good air knocking off a couple more tenths before the headers.

If you can get a heavier W-Body into the 14s with an NA Gen II, it will be extremely impressive. I would say anything south of 15.25 would be. My race weight in the Sunbird is only 2900 lbs. I imagine a Lumina and driver will be a good deal heavier than that. For each extra 100 lbs of weight it will take about 10 extra HP to run the same ET, so that is a challenge. Good luck in your efforts though. Don't let anybody convince you it can't be done. Just go out and do it!

[Superdave]

I had planned on going to the BOP event on the 11th, only problem is that my wife is due around then.. i don't wanna be at the track when she pops.. lol

I'm probably going this friday, you should stop down :P

I doubt they'll T&T on the rain date but i'll find out for sure...

[bracketracer]

Superdave,
I completely understand how your wife wouldn't appreciate you being at the track during the birth of your child. Any info you can get regarding Cordova's schedule on October 12 will be much appreciated though. If we can't race at a Test-N-Tune that date, I will have to look at the calendar and find a different one to go there for. I love Cordova, especially in the fall, and have set a number of PBs in both cars there.

On a different subject, regarding the times my Sunbird ran last weekend, I did some interesting "numbers crunching." I have some formulas that will estimate HP at the crank based on Race Weight & ET, or Race Weight & MPH. Based on them, and a Race Weight of 2900 lbs, my engine is producing between 170 & 175 HP at the crank. I hope that further tuning will get me up to about 180 HP, which should put me at about 14.7 @ 92.5 mph. Then it will be time to add the headers along with a proper tune. If they give me a 10 HP gain to about 190 HP (pretty conservative I think for 1 5/8" primary headers into 2" crossover, into 2.5" downpipe and exhaust), I should be running about 14.4 @ about 94 mph. If they give me a 15 HP gain to 195 HP, I should be running about 14.3 @ about 95 mph. If somehow they gave me 20 HP to 200 HP, I should be running about 14.2 @ about 96 mph. Any of these would look pretty good from an NA Gen II. I'll let you all know how it works out.

[RedBird]

guess i need to learn to drive(or get some decent race tires LOL)

224whp, 2.2 short times(blame the 17's) and a 14.9 @ 95.45mph just isn't cutting it..... haha.

[ForcedFirebird]

Boost is cheating in my book,

Um, yeah, whatever

although i'm not ruling it out for next year.

'bout time you smartened up

[1988GTU]

Boost is cheating in my book,

Wait until you go boosted. It will get you hooked and you probably will never see being n/a the same anymore.