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A few days ago I was thinking about adding power to the 2.8 engine in my 89 firebird. I have been told by some that the engine wont hold.... well I reworked the idea and crunched the numbers and bought my first part today. The build up will use a T3 turbo from Garret with internal wastegate. The turbo came from a ford thunber bird. Upgraded injectors can be found from the TPI 305 and run 19# while stock are about 7#. Using an FMU and stock injectors can be done but from what I have seen is not the best way. A BOV and oild and cooling lines will also be used as well as an oil cooler and intercooler. The stock internals have been shown to hold 5-6psi of boost without problems for well over 10,000 miles. photos will follow as the project wraps up.
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make sure you post photos of yoru blown motor too. Have fun. you might see 200 hp but thats about it. Could be fun if mid 14's is your goal -
Good luck mate, and post pics! I would bet the engine holds up well too. As for running fourteens... What did the V8s run in 1989?1994 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP Special Edition, Black 5-Speed
1995 BMW 540i, Alpineweiss-III, 6-Speed
1995 BMW 540i, Schwarz-II, Automatic
2004 Honda 919, Light Silver Metallic, 6-SpeedComment
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The engine is not the problem. It is a very stout engine. It has all the major upgrades like big journals and internal balance. The problem you are going to run into however is breathing. Back then the heads, intake and cam were quite sad. Not to mention the exhaust. Upgrade all that crap with some ported heads and intake and a cam grond for turbo apps and you will have no problem making power. Oh and if you want to keep this thing going a balance job and upgraded pistons will go a long way.1993 EXT. CAB, 3.4L V6 TBI, 5spd manual. Sonoma
1990 4Door, 3.2L V6 TBI, 5spd manual. 4X4. Trooper
Because... I am, CANADIANComment
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Agreed! Simple turbo cam will go a long way. Even with the poor flowing intake.Andy
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fastest 1/8: 10.19@ 67.17
fastest 1/4: 16.16@ 82.70
62mm TB, 1.6 roller tip rockers, Ostrich 2.0, UD pulley, TB heater bypass, K&N, 180* stat, No cat, 99Grand AM dual cooling fans. 4T65E swap FDR 3.69, EP LSD, F.A.S.T. transmission controller, TransGo shift kit.
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Just a suggestion, rather than use a T3 turbo (which might result in a very "peaky" power band) use an IHI turbo. It also came in later T-Tbirds. The T3 is made to boost @ around 1500rpm and push 16-25lbs of air STOCK!! The IHI comes on around 900rpm @ is good for 7-15lbs.
Note this info is based on my previous car ('86 Cougar XR7 T3 Turbo 5 speed) and my then neighbors car ('90 Mustang w/ a '87 T-Tbird IHI motor)Tuning a car is full of compromises. You must decide if you are willing to give up either reliability, performance, or a whole load of cash. Also remember that repairs will seem to come up much more often as you strive for even more performanceComment
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The IHI is a more expensive unit but the original Miller Woods conversion used one with great success resulting in 200 - 210 BHP with around 7-8 PSI of boost.
It was bulletproof on a stock 2.8 engine and was absolutely the best way to give more power to those engines.
If you want to rebuild your engine prior to boosting it, be sure to get a 3.1 crank and pistons and while you are at it, buy some forged 3.1 pistons for higher boost pressure. I run a limiter at 13.5 PSI with no problems.Comment
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A Garret is usually an upgrade from an IHI. I would rather have a turbo that spools a little later than have one that blows hot air near redline. As far as the heads go, thats more of a concern for NA builds, a strong bottom end is what you want for a turbo build. I think youll do fine, good luck, and be careful tuning!Comment
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Sorry I havnt gotten back to this for a bit but I have been doing some work research. The build is now well planed. The 2.8 will keep the stock 76mm stroke and will be outfitted with 6 inch C to C T6 alum rods that have been narrowed, heads will be ported and polished with a new intake. Pistons will come from the 6G72 mitsubishi engine. Block will be bored out to 91.1mm to fit the pistons. Crank will be shaved and balanced for safe operation upto 8000rpm and will be fitted with a 7500rpm redline and limiter. The Garret T3 from a thunderbird should be set to about 12psi for testing and we will see how it goes. New headers are going to be fabed up to bring the exhaust forward into turbo. Compressor air will flow through the front mount cooler from a volvo 740. Using an aftermarket BOV, manual boost control, and wastegate with a 3.62psi spring. Injectors from a mustang and a vortch FMU will round out the package for now.
Will try to keep up betterComment
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My first car purchased with my own money was an 1985 Firebird 2.8L 5 spd, the year GM made it better. I was told by many it wouldn't last but those individuals had no knowledge of the improvements GM made that year.
The very first race I had in the car was believe it or not against a four cylinder turbo coup 85 or 86 which took place spontaneouly from a low speed and both cars ran even where at full throttle and shifts no ground was lost and non was gained.
The T3 is a much better choice having worked with it as much as I have because you have several more upgrade options, it is cheaper to work on and if you are as fortunate as I have been you may still be able to locate reasonably priced models from the early turbo mustangs, Mercurys and possibly T-birds on Ebay for under $100. This particular turbo used around 85 and up has a .60 compressor wheel and .63 turbine housing which will be perfect for the 2.8L allowing it to breath up top as well as maintain a desent efficiency.
The intake will not prove to be much of a problem at all because the restriction is more in association with the engine trying to suck the air in, when you reverse that situation the resistance to air being blown through it will not be the same until you start to reach pressure levels higher than what it can flow freely under pressure, if this were not so you would not be able to justify the use of a different cam suited to turbocharging.
You should go no higher than about 10 psi on stock pistons and that's coming from someone who has broken a 2.8L piston ring land though detonation at some point played a part over time. I have run as high as 12 psi intercooled in a Fiero 2.8L and they are the same engine except for the more restrictive upper plenum and both cars are very close in weight. I used a T3 from the Chrysler turbo cars with a .42 compressor and .48 turbine housing no where near the efficiency of the .60c, .63t found in some of the early Ford cars and it still ran like crazy putting many challengers to shame.
Just in case you don't have it there is a turbo calculator here that will help you see the benefit of the turbine and compressor housings for your application. One more thing, it is probably different for rear wheel drive but I understand front wheel drive manuals due to blocker mechanisms of some sort can not be shifted easily above 7000 rpm so check into that on the T5.
Last edited by Guest; 09-20-2006, 08:35 AM.Comment
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