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  • #1

    Turbo installation help plz

    I was working on making my crossover pipe and now im thinking my 18 gauge will not work.(too thin maycrack easy??) does anyone know what would be the smallest gauge that should be used. im using 2" steel piping. i have 16 gauge and am now using that, but i was just wondering if 18 is too small. i may use the 18 for the intake now but im running out of 16. im useing steel for now, maybe upgrade to stainless once i get better at welding and once i get the car running. but right now im focusing on getting this to work properly, not looks. but i know stainless work better with heat and strength.

    Thanks

    im sure ill have some other Q's later on some other stuff but this is it for now
    89 BerettaGT 3400 5spd
    60' 2.106 street tires
    Best ET 14.313@95.37 N/A

    Now Boosted
    14s@109 (poor tune still rich, poor driving skills, poor owner)
    Tags: None
  • #2
    RE: Turbo installation help plz

    You can use 18ga mild steel, but don't expect it to last. I would use 16ga at a minimum, thicker if possible..or use stainless. What kind of material did you use for the manifolds themselves?

    Marty
    '99 Z-28 - Weekend Driver
    '98 Dodge Neon - Winter Beater
    '84 X-11 - Time and Money Pit
    '88 Fiero Formula - Bone stock for now

    Quote of the week:
    Originally posted by Aaron
    This is why I don't build crappy headers. I'm not sure, I don't know too much about welding.

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    • #3
      stock manifolds. i just used the flanges off the cross over pipe for something to bolt up to. Im also using some flex piping. i have seen some other pics of turbos and all of them had SOLID crossover to the turbo. i had a feeling that under har acceleration the engine will rock maybe cause cracking easier. my turbo will be mounted to the body so it does not move. the exhaust side when i get to it, i will make room so the engine can move with out hitting it.
      The stock crossover i would have used but i need something as close as possible to the engine. Im useing header wrap as well. I talked to a rep from summit and they said to only put 2 layers on insead of 4 or more. this will hold some heat but shouldn't crack anything.

      its not going as fast as i want becasue its RAINING and i don't have a garage.
      89 BerettaGT 3400 5spd
      60' 2.106 street tires
      Best ET 14.313@95.37 N/A

      Now Boosted
      14s@109 (poor tune still rich, poor driving skills, poor owner)

      Comment

      • #4
        I can attest to the cracking thing. I did not put a flex joint in my exhaust when I put the headers in, and it caused the rear header to crack. That is why I put the stock manifolds back in. If you do not put the flex in the crossover, then you would need it in the downpipe.
        Taylor
        1988 Olds Cutlass Supreme 3100 MPFI
        1990 Pontiac Grand Prix STE 3.1 MPFI
        1994 Olds Cutlass Supreme convertible
        1998 Lincoln Mark VIII
        "find something simple and complicate it"

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        • #5
          yeah, also i don't want to weight of the turbo on the crossover pipes. so i'll have to make some kind of bracket the turbo can bolt to. i was thinking to put a flex on the downpipe as well. why not it would be safer i think.

          right now i have my crossover half done since i posted last, but now i need to mount the turbo. so i can get the crossover, to fit into the exhaust inlet side. my eyes hurt i blinded myself 3 times. i need an autodarken helmet.

          I also have not welded my pips at all just 4 spor weld to hold it in place for now. incase i need to change something later.
          89 BerettaGT 3400 5spd
          60' 2.106 street tires
          Best ET 14.313@95.37 N/A

          Now Boosted
          14s@109 (poor tune still rich, poor driving skills, poor owner)

          Comment

          • #6
            my eyes hurt i blinded myself 3 times. i need an autodarken helmet.
            STOP WELDING and buy a cheap plastic welding helmet from Walmart or welding supply store. At least double stack two dark sun glasses. You'll go blind man!

            The spot I know thats perfect for the turbo support is on the trans braket. The DPipe can be solid and supported by the rear head or trans...but a flex pipe would be nice down there on the Upipe or at the end of the DPipe. And it is a good idea to use flex bellows on the x-over pipe. The heat expands the pipes at different rates and contract accordanly when cooled. I've seen too many preaty boy pipes turn into a patch job in no time without flex bellows. Good luck..should be fun.
            88 Beretta GTU turbo . 90 Black ASC/McLaren TGP, awaiting 4t80. 2003 Grand AM se 3400/4t45 daily grind.

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            • #7
              I would personally support the turbo off the trans or rear of the heads.
              Due to the heat in the exhast pre-turbo, the pipes will get very hot. Now if you rely on a flexpipe/bellows, with the heat that is there, it will crack, and break, in a short time.
              Now bolting the turbo solid to the driveline so that the turbo will move with the rocking and thrusting of the engine, will aleviate a LOT of stresses on that flex pipe/bellows. Still use a bellows in the crossover to account for heat expansion, where the pipes will grow in length when they heat up. Use a ball joint (similar to what is between the rear manifold and down pipe), for the exit from the turbo going into the down pipe, this again will allow for engine movement without relying io a 'flex' joint.

              *edit* The placement of the bellows in the crossover should be between each cylinder bank.
              Picture an upper case Y, the top of it going to each cylinder bank, the verticle part going to the turbo. Place the bellows in one of the upper parts, so that the expansion of the pipes does not try and push the manifolds apart, and cause the crossover to crack or the heads to crack.

              Comment

              • #8
                i thought the turbo was supposed to be supported by the manifolds. if you solidly mount the turbo to somethign doesnt that cause unnecesary stress in the manifolds and lead to cracking due to the expansion of the materials? not trying to be smart, just learning for future reference.
                If you aren't friends with a liar, you aren't friends with anyone.

                Comment

                • #9
                  Originally posted by Doubt_Incarnate
                  i thought the turbo was supposed to be supported by the manifolds. if you solidly mount the turbo to somethign doesnt that cause unnecesary stress in the manifolds and lead to cracking due to the expansion of the materials? not trying to be smart, just learning for future reference.
                  No you NEVER want the turbo to be supported by the x-over/manifolds, if you do THAT will cause them to crack.

                  You always want the turbo to have a support bracket. This is also why a bellows is used in the x-over, to allow for the expansion.

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                  • #10
                    would this bracket be sort of mounted to the turbo like the wastegat actuator?
                    If you aren't friends with a liar, you aren't friends with anyone.

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      I supose it could be....

                      For mine used the two lower studs that attaches the turbine inlet to the manifold and made a bracket that went from there down to the engine mount (most convenient).

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        ok let understand what your saying about the b joint type thing.

                        use the same style like the crossover pipes flanges?? that sounds like a good idea if thats what your saying. this would allow for the pipes to move slightly and move for heat expansion. mmm. i have not mounted the turbo on becasue of the stress in making a mounting bracket. i just ripped out my battery tray. my turbo intake housing needs to be rotated 180 degrees becasue way i want to mount this. also my turbo seem to leave me very little room. all these other pics it looks like peope have tons of room.but the problem is i have to rotate this befor i make a mount. and then i have to figure out my actuator bracket becasue i will have to make a custom one then. mmm

                        Im using a turbo off a 91 syclone.


                        ok i was lookng online here http://www.dmeexpansionjoints.com/ex...connectors.htm

                        but my old 3400 crossover had one on it about 3" long would that work if i used 3 of them on each end of the "Y" going into the turbo??? or is 3 too much. it doesn't flex that much but it may work??? would that be better than flex pipe??


                        I have a helmet its just i have to figure out where im welding and i off someitmes. my welder is crappy. it doesn't have a safty thing where if i touch the metal at all it sparks. not when i pull the trigger. i guess the older ones don't have this safty devise in it. so i touch the metal on accedent sometimes with my helmet up. LOL it sucks trying to figure out where im welding. looks like chicken poop sometimes.
                        89 BerettaGT 3400 5spd
                        60' 2.106 street tires
                        Best ET 14.313@95.37 N/A

                        Now Boosted
                        14s@109 (poor tune still rich, poor driving skills, poor owner)

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          That would be the bellows type we are talking about.

                          You only need one, in the piping that runs between the manifolds, just somewhere in there.

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            well i plan on putting one like that before my turbo exhaust inlet. maybe ill try and get one of those. i still need to make a bracket and rotate my intake housing
                            89 BerettaGT 3400 5spd
                            60' 2.106 street tires
                            Best ET 14.313@95.37 N/A

                            Now Boosted
                            14s@109 (poor tune still rich, poor driving skills, poor owner)

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              I wouln'd use stock bellows on a turbo app. They are too thin and prob weak from age, exposure. Use new flex bellows...perfered steel..or stainless.
                              http://www.turbosedan.com/cutlass/engine/DSC01614.JPG (Joshua..aka.."TurboSadan" Pic)
                              This is the kind of bellow to use. Use something similar. Put one on each bank of the engine to keep the left and right bank isolated and the turbo isolated. You just need two...and one big one for the Down pipe...but not really nasisary unless you worry about engine rock.

                              On that mig..I think they make a foot switch for it. I feel you though..I have a cheap Arc welder.
                              88 Beretta GTU turbo . 90 Black ASC/McLaren TGP, awaiting 4t80. 2003 Grand AM se 3400/4t45 daily grind.

                              Comment

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