92 Grand Prix SE coupe with GTP options

[Prix]

Wasup all, I have been tampering with this site for sometime and finally decided to just join up, I don't have any pic's or nothing yet but what I own is a 92 Grand Prix SE (with most GTP options not including the dohc 3.4)......anyway it's completely bone stock and I the first things I want to try and do is install a chip but what I wanted to ask is does anyone know or have proof which one works best for my 3.1? ...I looked at ebay which really confuses me on which to buy and wha to believe in.

[bszopi]

First recommendation... don't look on ebay for chips.

Second recommendation... PM Ben (sappyse107) about a chip. He used to do them for FDP Performance until they stopped doing business, and is currently working to set up his own business to sell chips and other parts. He's one of the admins here, and basically everyone will vouch for him. Check out the Computer Tuning section of the forum and you can probably read up on chips and Ben.

[Prix]

ok, but with that chip how much Hp could I expect to actually gain?, because I want to test it with the chip and without the chip at the drag and eventually I hope with the chip, some source of air intake (K&N filter doesn't really make it's self known), throttle body, exhaust (which I want to have a deep and muscular sound like it has stock) I could at least see hp gains in the 150's or 160 and low 16's or high 15's in the quater mile then do the more extensive stuff later. I thought about calling it a day and buying the 50 shot of nos but on a 108,900 engine and transmission worries me.

[acascianelli]

you should allready be around 200hp with that motor, and low 16's high 15's. ive heard of people running nitrous on the pushrod motors but id be afraid to try it on the dohc motor, those motors run pretty warm as it is.

[sharkey]

he doesnt have a DOHC. his car has gtp options without the dohc motor. read it again.

[Prix]

he doesnt have a DOHC. his car has gtp options without the dohc motor. read it again.

yep,if I had a 3.4 it wouldn't of been so hard to beat a freakin 2001 4dr Ford Focus >_<(very depressing)

[SappySE107]

wait, so you have the GTP badges from the factory, all the GTP options, yet no 3.4 DOHC? Very odd. The chip for the 3.1s give it 6 hp at the wheels, which is 8-9 crank. I dunno about running 16s with just a chip but some people run faster than others (I had a cam, port work, exhaust, and tuning and ran a 16.8 with my 3.1, others claim 16.8 with the stock motor). It is the only chip available with real results though so if you are interested let me know. If you want to do other work on the motor, this is definetly the site to ask about mods

[TrailMug]

Top-end swap seems to be the most dramatic upgrade for the stock LH0 3.1.. When the stroke lengthened for 2.8->3.1, nothing was done to increase air supply. The HP curve peak was moved from about 5000RPM back to about 4400 as a result (if my info serves). With fuel cutoff at 6000RPMish, there's definitely some room to extend the curve. From my way of thinking, 4400RPM is where the factory intake can no longer keep up. Assuming the valves can still close, and non-bottlenecking intake and exhaust, shouldn't more exchanges mean more power?

Another random question -- was stock compression kept relatively low (8.5:1) only to simplify the addition of a turbo option?

[SappySE107]

compression was 8.9:1, and 8.8:1 for the turbo. It was probably kept low for emissions. Another reason for the powerband moving down is the stroke itself, not just the intake manifolds limiting air supply.

[TrailMug]

Most of the info I can find points to 8.9CR for the LH8 and 8.5 for the LH0 (turbo and N/A), but if it's wrong, it's wrong

[TrailMug]

LB8* sorry

[Prix]

wait, so you have the GTP badges from the factory, all the GTP options, yet no 3.4 DOHC? Very odd. The chip for the 3.1s give it 6 hp at the wheels, which is 8-9 crank. I dunno about running 16s with just a chip but some people run faster than others (I had a cam, port work, exhaust, and tuning and ran a 16.8 with my 3.1, others claim 16.8 with the stock motor). It is the only chip available with real results though so if you are interested let me know. If you want to do other work on the motor, this is definetly the site to ask about mods

No, it has SE Badges on it, It was odd to me too at first becase the for sale sign on the car before I bought it said (3.1 v6 with GTP options) I was hoping maybe the guy doesn't know the difference but I he did. I did some research and found about a "GTP package" that was offered from the factory which made it look like a GTP with most of it's options.

....and I'm Definitly interested!!...I'm even more glad to hear real results! This site to me has educated and is my "best resource" about the 3.1 v6 and have been for 2yrs now. Whenever possible youget a chance, point me into the direction name a price and it's a done deal. ^_^

Top-end swap seems to be the most dramatic upgrade for the stock LH0 3.1.. When the stroke lengthened for 2.8->3.1, nothing was done to increase air supply. The HP curve peak was moved from about 5000RPM back to about 4400 as a result (if my info serves). With fuel cutoff at 6000RPMish, there's definitely some room to extend the curve. From my way of thinking, 4400RPM is where the factory intake can no longer keep up. Assuming the valves can still close, and non-bottlenecking intake and exhaust, shouldn't more exchanges mean more power?

Another random question -- was stock compression kept relatively low (8.5:1) only to simplify the addition of a turbo option?

I thought it was 4800 rpm? for a 92 gen II 3.1? mine reaches 4800 or right at 5000 rpm.
..also what is all included with a top end swap I hear that over and over...



..

[SappySE107]

If you want the chip, they are 125 shipped and I will send you the order form with all the info i will need to make it.

Top end swap consists of the heads and the intake manifolds/fuel rail. http://60degreev6.com/modules.php?op...rtid=35&page=1

That should cover it. Id like to get some pics from someone that does the swap, but for now its just text.

[TrailMug]

I have seen sources quote the 3.1's HP peak from 4200 up to 4800, so i took a medium value -- my stock V6 on a warm day stops pulling hard after the lowish 4000s, and I feel like I'm sitting on the other side of the curve waiting to shift.

For the "3100" engine, and the intake and heads were revised (among other upgrades like SFI). The "family tree" page has excellent information on all the updates. Since the bottom of the engine (nearly everything in the block) stayed the same, replacing heads-and-up in an older 3.1 to take advantage of the increased airflow is a natural consideration. The 3100 eventually inherited the 3400 intake, and is now up to almost 180hp. You probably have seen information about "3400 hybrid engines" on forums that have had mods to this new design. Although the new intake manifold doesn't just "bolt up" (there are some issues like throttle cable, EGR, and accessory clearance), it is a simpler task than many other internal engine performance upgrades.

I am swimming in information and HowTo's, and hope to head to the parts yard and tackle this project in the summer months. I have a decent camera, and will do my best to have the patience to use it a lot.

[SappySE107]

sweet I don't know if we ever got proof of this, but I think the gen 3 blocks have 3 oil arteries vs 2 for the gen 2 motors. gen 3 are roller cam, which is going to reduce friction and give more duration by design. I am not aware of the oiling making much difference though for longevity and you can always use a larger oil pump if it bothers you. The EGR isn't too much of a hassle, especially if you turn it off in the computer hahaha, otherwise adapter time, or figure out the wiring to make the stock computer work. Hmmm, i bet if someone made an electrical device to convert the signals, they could get some business with these gen 3 swaps. Coolant pipe, I wan wondering if the newer press in types can be threaded, or if the new type completely coverted into the older cars. I haven't done a top end swap so I really don't know.