Introduction and request for help!

[Michhiker28]

So completely new to the site...have done some browsing and research....a wonderful resource, but even with all that, I figured I better register to see if I can request some help and guidance.

The short version of the story:
2 years ago our then 12 year old daughter approached her mom and I because she wanted to rebuild a car, on her own, for her 16th birthday. She wanted to do all the work herself and pay for it herself as well. We agreed to support her dream and let her try. Since I had never done anything like this, we have had a lot of learning to do along the way, but we have had a lot of fun too. If you would like the longer version of the story you can visit her build thread on Pennock's.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/085309.html

This last weekend she was at the Maker's Faire in Detroit, and completely stripped down the 2.8 that was in the car.

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/19098508/maker-faire-returns-to-the-henry-ford-july-28-29

She has a 3.4 out of a 95 camaro to work with, that is what she wants to put in the car. She is in the process of pulling it apart. Still needs to get the pistons, crank, and cam out. So we will see what we have to work with.

We have put an approximate 200 horse limit on her, so she is trying to get as close to that as she can of course...lol! We know that there will need to be some machining done, so no worries there. She also may have the ability to either turbo this engine or a small NOS shot. The other limits include: keeping the 4 speed Muncie, keeping the fiero intakes etc (I know....she could gain a lot there) but the plug and play makes this much easier and it is our first build. The cat can come off...we don't sniff in this state. She likes an aggressive big cam sound. So with that what would you do?

Cam - thinking 260 or 272 crane
Pistons?
Lifters?
Rods?
Valve and head work?
etc. etc. etc.

Would love to hear from the experts here! Thanks so much

-MH

[ericjon262]

hopefully you're still with us here.

First, Welcome to the site!

second, the muncie will take everything an Iron head motor will throw at it!

The Fiero Upper intake is a huge bottle neck int he performance of the engine, just past the throttle body it necks down very small, with isn't good for performance. some have cut and welded them with respectable gains, others have made their own dual TB intake. either way will compliment the cam swap nicely.

take the exhaust manifolds off, and you will see there is a pinch point in there too, grinding that out is worth 7-10 hp over stock!

sticking with the iron head motor will leave quite a bit on the table, which in this case isn't a bad thing, let her really learn to drive before she gets behind the wheel of a cammed built aluminum head motor!

I would reccomend updating the computer to a 7730 from the stock ECM, they aren't very tune-able.

if you're still with us, post up a few progress pics and let us know what you need, most of us are more than willing to help!

[caffeine]

I'm also going to vouch for upgrading to a 7730. The wiring is very simple and its an easy way to learn engine wiring.

[MY91GT(Z)]

welcome to the site

hearing what your doin with your daughter i hope that one or both of my daughters take to cars like that as they are always under the car with me now being they are 6yrs & 2yrs old.

If your interested in a site that has lots of lil things to improve the fiero look at rodneydickman.com and im sure their is a few others.

For cam i would go with the 272 and just do a top swap from the 3400 and she should be pretty close to the 200 mark

[geoffinbc]

Guys he has stated clearly he does not want to do a Hybrid or 3400 Swap. He has chosen a good beginner project that will keep him on budget and within his skill set. Remember he is working mostly from his daughters budget and only helping her.

I would not suggest the Crane 272 Cam for this project. While it is a good all out hydraulic performer I think the COMP 260 Cam will suit your needs much better. I would buy the COMP 260 K Kit to get every part you need for a successful cam swap. I would supplement it with Small Block Chevy Viton valve stem seals on the intake and exhaust valves.

[Michhiker28]

Thank all for the suggestions and guidance. We will definitely be checking in. Both the 2.8 and the 3.4 are now torn down to block. Kathryn is insisting on doing as much of the work as possible herself, including port matching the heads. But there will definitely be some machine shop work that has to occur. I know we are going to have the block tanked and fluxed. New main bearings and cam bearing installed. We might be looking at boring if the specs that she is pulling of the telescope guages are any indication...looks a bit on the loose side right now.

Love the suggestions for different heads etc., but remember that this is a 14 year old, first project like this and engine swap and it is also a learning opportunity. So we are trying to help her see how things work, make some good positive gains, but also keep it relatively plug and play. Not sure if everyone saw the CNN link, but here it is in case you missed it.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/10/24/tech/girl-builds-fiero/index.html?iref=allsearch

-MH

[bszopi]

The article on CNN was what got this thread active all of the sudden. I saw it when it was originally started, but didn't have the time to reply, and then sadly forgot about it. When I saw the CNN article, I started a new thread about it, and then someone linked to this original thread.

Being a bunch of engine junkies, we often get carried away with recommendations for wild and crazy builds. But, the knowledge here can help with even basic rebuilds, such as Kathryn is doing. So feel free to ask about anything that comes up.

Brad via Tapatalk

[ericjon262]

So completely new to the site...have done some browsing and research....a wonderful resource, but even with all that, I figured I better register to see if I can request some help and guidance.

The short version of the story:
2 years ago our then 12 year old daughter approached her mom and I because she wanted to rebuild a car, on her own, for her 16th birthday. She wanted to do all the work herself and pay for it herself as well. We agreed to support her dream and let her try. Since I had never done anything like this, we have had a lot of learning to do along the way, but we have had a lot of fun too. If you would like the longer version of the story you can visit her build thread on Pennock's.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/085309.html

This last weekend she was at the Maker's Faire in Detroit, and completely stripped down the 2.8 that was in the car.

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/19098508/maker-faire-returns-to-the-henry-ford-july-28-29

She has a 3.4 out of a 95 camaro to work with, that is what she wants to put in the car. She is in the process of pulling it apart. Still needs to get the pistons, crank, and cam out. So we will see what we have to work with.

We have put an approximate 200 horse limit on her, so she is trying to get as close to that as she can of course...lol! We know that there will need to be some machining done, so no worries there. She also may have the ability to either turbo this engine or a small NOS shot. The other limits include: keeping the 4 speed Muncie, keeping the fiero intakes etc (I know....she could gain a lot there) but the plug and play makes this much easier and it is our first build. The cat can come off...we don't sniff in this state. She likes an aggressive big cam sound. So with that what would you do?

Cam - thinking 260 or 272 crane
Pistons?
Lifters?
Rods?
Valve and head work?
etc. etc. etc.

Would love to hear from the experts here! Thanks so much

-MH

I wouldn't do boost on the old Iron head motor, the amount of work you would have into it would be insane compared to a head swap that would net similar gains naturally aspirated. Nos on the other hand could net controlled gains (you can pull the bottle out when she's not at the track) make sure if she ports the heads that she doesn't take the hump out of the floor, that WILL hurt flow.

[Michhiker28]

Thanks again all. We have both the 2.8 and the 3.4 disassembled. She is getting pretty good at taking these things apart. The 3.4 she took apart on her own in one day while I was at work, right down to bare block and heads after showing her what to do on the 2.8.

The block is going off to the machine shop soon for cleaning, magnafluxing, new cam bearings and mains, and will probably need to be bored. She checked the pistons and the bores with telescope gauges and mics and based on her measurements she thinks it needs bored. She's interested to see how accurate her measurements are compared to theirs, so we'll see about that part.

She does want a bit bigger cam since she likes the lope sound and wants a bit more power as well. I like the recommendation of the k kits. So, with that being said:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-k16-233-4

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-k16-232-4

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/crn-253902

She is also looking at these

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-rp1413-12

or these with the smaller cam

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-rp1414-12

and these

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-506-16

Thoughts and input please!

-MH

[ericjon262]

I would go with the bigger cam and the regular rockers, so that way when she gets bored of the big cam, she can get a bit more out of it.

[pocket-rocket]

I found a digital bore gauge on eBay this past summer for under $100. It wasn't a top of the line one, but it's good till .00005". It reads in .00005 increments, so to me it's not a true .00005, but more like .0001, which is perfect for something not in race applications.

Telescope gauges and mics are way better than nothing, but you have to be certain everything is clean because dirt can throw your readings off.

Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

[unchained01]

That's a decent starter cam for her. That and a set of headers This is going to be a DD for her right ?

[Michhiker28]

That's a decent starter cam for her. That and a set of headers This is going to be a DD for her right ?

Yes for the most part. She wants so lope, so we are looking at this for the build and are interested in your input.

This cam

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-k16-233-4

these rockers

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-rp1413-12

and a bore with these pistons

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/slp-h684cp50mm/overview/make/chevrolet

Thoughts?

[ericjon262]

I'd want to get a pushrod length checker and order the pushrods to spec. other than that, I think that would make for a fun car!

[3400-95-Modified]

Yes for the most part. She wants so lope, so we are looking at this for the build and are interested in your input.

This cam

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-k16-233-4

these rockers

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-rp1413-12

and a bore with these pistons

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/slp-h684cp50mm/overview/make/chevrolet

Thoughts?

Lope is awesome... but sometimes a very large pain to tune since the map readings are so high and all over the place. I doubt you'll get anything like mine... LOL

http://s257.beta.photobucket.com/user/3400modified/media/Beretta/Twoofakind004.mp4.html

http://s257.beta.photobucket.com/user/3400modified/media/Pinky%20Parts/MVI_0454.mp4.html

http://s257.beta.photobucket.com/user/3400modified/media/Pinky%20Parts/MVI_2755.mp4.html

It is nice to see someone building up a good ole MPFI motor in a Fiero though.