3400 N/A Monte Build Thread

[Jonpro03]

hawt

[02GT_Skyhigh]

Im excited to hear the 180* header sound!
Looking Gooood!

[SappySE107]

+1

Thats what I think about this thread. I too want to hear what this sounds like. That it is in a Monte is just slightly absurd.

[bob442]

Thats all i keep hearing from everyone is they want to hear this thing, now one cares about the detail, perfomance or anything else, just the sound...

So Ben, are you suggesting i should have just put in a LS4? or 3800?


On a very important note, pertaining to anyone who has built or installed headers, how close does your cross over come to the transmission. right now my issue is one pipe is basically just touching the back side of where the conector for the trans pluges in. i'm worried about that and th gasket cooking on the side cover for it aswell

[SappySE107]

People do a 180 header setup for the sound....

yeah man, 3800 swap, duh. Its a monte, everyone does an L67. I was told on mymonte that no one mods a 60V6.

[tad89]

Does any one know of some good cam sources for the 3400 ?

[robert 1980]

My cross over is maybe an inch from the top of my trans.Put it this way when i have to take off my shift cables i cry alittle on the inside.Ben can spec a cam shaft for you thats his job nice work bob my build is going to start very soon too.

[SappySE107]

I have lots of cam options on wot-tech.com.

And the reason its absurd in a monte is because the sound doesn't really match the car. It belongs in a fiero. And that makes it absurd Like I think you should use another motor. ROFL!

[Blacktree]

Im excited to hear the 180* header sound!
Looking Gooood!

I agree, those headers look pretty badass.

But FYI, the headers are not 180-degree. This is a 6-cylinder engine. The cylinders in each bank fire 240 degrees apart, not 180. And since the 60-degree V6 is an even-fire engine, you don't need to have head-pipes crossing over to the other cylinder bank.

[SappySE107]

You have 6 cylinders firing at 60 degrees apart in 1 2 3 4 5 6 firing order. Bank to bank. 1 and 4 are paired, and those are 180 degrees apart in the firing order.

[Blacktree]

You have 6 cylinders firing at 60 degrees apart in 1 2 3 4 5 6 firing order. Bank to bank. 1 and 4 are paired, and those are 180 degrees apart in the firing order.

The cylinders actually fire 120 degrees apart (crankshaft rotation). Cylinders 1 and 4 fire 360 degrees apart.

180-degree headers are specifically designed for an odd-fire V8 (like the SBC). An 8 cylinder engine has a firing event every 90 degrees of crankshaft rotation. With a V8, that would mean each header would have an exhaust pulse every 180 degrees of crankshaft rotation... if it were an even-fire engine. But a SBC is not. It's an odd-fire engine. So the "odd" cylinders are piped over to the opposite header to even things out... which yields an exhaust pulse every 180 degrees of crankshaft rotation in each header. The even exhaust pulses are better for scavenging, which yields a few extra ponies.

There's a good explanation of that here: http://www.burnsstainless.com/bundleofsnakes-2.aspx

Since the 60-degree V6 is an even-fire engine, such measures are not necessary. Each header gets an exhaust pulse every 240 degrees of crankshaft rotation. There's nothing to even out, because it's already evenly spaced.

Anyway, sorry for the off-topic ramblings. I hope some of you find it informative.

[pocket-rocket]

The cylinders actually fire 120 degrees apart (crankshaft rotation). Cylinders 1 and 4 fire 360 degrees apart.

180-degree headers are specifically designed for an odd-fire V8 (like the SBC). An 8 cylinder engine has a firing event every 90 degrees of crankshaft rotation. With a V8, that would mean each header would have an exhaust pulse every 180 degrees of crankshaft rotation... if it were an even-fire engine. But a SBC is not. It's an odd-fire engine. So the "odd" cylinders are piped over to the opposite header to even things out... which yields an exhaust pulse every 180 degrees of crankshaft rotation in each header. The even exhaust pulses are better for scavenging, which yields a few extra ponies.

There's a good explanation of that here: http://www.burnsstainless.com/bundleofsnakes-2.aspx

Since the 60-degree V6 is an even-fire engine, such measures are not necessary. Each header gets an exhaust pulse every 240 degrees of crankshaft rotation. There's nothing to even out, because it's already evenly spaced.

Anyway, sorry for the off-topic ramblings. I hope some of you find it informative.

But normal headers don't sound like this on a mild 2.8

[bob442]

what pocket said.


Blacktree, the crank is 130* out, but with the cylinders in the bores, and the heads off, you can see how the firing is 180* off, i could agree with you when i was staring at my crank out of the block a while back before i had the motor back together, and had the headers mocked up finally and thought SOAB, but, i gotta pull apart a 3100 this weekend so i'l take a video of the motor rotating by hand with the heads offf to put this to sleep, sound good?

[bob442]

stupid question, should i need a wideband 02 sensor and gauge to tune my monte with the hp tuners, or will the stock work just as good?

[SappySE107]

You can tune most of it with the stock narrowband but you will want a wideband once you are into power enrichment so that you know the exact AF ratio. Narrowband isn't good for that, and wideband is useful for the normal tuning as well. It just isn't necessary.