2.8 cheap race motor upgrades?

[sureshot007]

I am sure this has been discussed time and time again, but I have been doing so much searching on the internet lately that my brain in just turning to mush, and I am hoping that you guys can just help me out a little.

I am looking at swapping a 2.8 in place of the AMC 2.5 4cyl I have now. Due to the rules, I can't exceed 3080cc's, so I'm stuck with the 2.8 as the only option. I only want to spend money if it will net me some good gains. So lets say you have a budget of $500+/- and a goal of 175hp, what would you do? (NOTE: cannot be forced induction, and no nitrous).

I appreciate any help you guys can giveme.

[bszopi]

Welcome.

http://60degreev6.com/forum/showthread.php/46447-Need-help-with-information-for-actual-race-vehicle?p=423460#post423460

[sureshot007]

Well then, never mind. My codriver has it all under control.

[bszopi]

It seemed awfully wierd that the 2 vehicles were the same, but I looked up the IP addresses of you and him, and they were different (seemed like different states even), so I just figured it was a coincidence.

[sureshot007]

I'm actually going to bump this thread a little. The other thread has gotten a little off track from my original idea of "cheap" race motor upgrades.

So lets say you have a 2.8 block, what are the cheapest things you can do to net the most benefit? Aluminum heads and cam? Lets say the budget for parts is $500 - what would you do?

[bszopi]

I doubt you'd be able to do aluminum heads for under $500 due to the electrical changes and parts required to go to MPFI.

I am no iron head expert, but I would definitely say cam at the least. Headers will also help, since you will need to be doing some changes to the exhaust system anyway. Then, just look at the intake side and see if you can get more air in, now that you have the ability to get more air out. This would include a different carb, as well as some possible modifications to the manifold.

Here is a good resource for you, just apply it to the 2.8 instead of the 3.1. http://members.shaw.ca/betterthanyou/isuzueng.htm

[sureshot007]

I'm assuming that any "stock" parts would be sourced from the local u-pull-it and had for super cheap. The $500 is for anything I'd have to buy that I couldn't get from a junkyard.

[bszopi]

Again, if you are still looking at your original time frame, going to the aluminum heads just isn't going to be viable. Now, if you were to push back the new engine to the July race (which was mentioned in the other thread), it might be possible. But there is still a lot of work involved with going to the aluminum heads. It will be a huge improvement in the end, but it will take a decent amount of time to do it. I'd hate to get you started on that route, then start having hiccups here and there and cause you to miss a race o to unforseen obstacles. If I was going to switch to aluminum heads on something like you have, I would do it over the winter months, or whenever there was a decently sized break in the racing schedule.

[sureshot007]

Lets dismiss the time frame aspect. There is no way we could have something viable for the June event, and it wouldn't be the end of the world if we were still running the stock motor for July. I'm looking for something for next season, so long term isn't an issue. Plus, my crew chief is unemployed right now, so it will give him something do to with his time

[bszopi]

Well, one thing you might want to jump on is the ECM and harness in the following thread - http://60degreev6.com/forum/showthre...705#post423705

That would give you the required ECM and harness, ready to be used on a MPFI setup. If you found an later model 2.8 (ie, the larger crank journal model - 87+?), and just threw on a 3100 top end (from head gaskets up), you would be at 2833cc and a CR of 12.03. Make that with a Crane/Comp cam, such as the 260 or 272 grinds, and you have a pretty powerful little engine. I'll let others discuss it more, as I am not an expert when it comes to the hybrids. The flat top pistons may need to have valve reliefs cut in them depending on the lift of the cam.

[sureshot007]

That's kinda what I had in mind. I guess I need to find someone that has put something like this together already to get an idea of the exact parts list I need and what sorts of things I should avoid - someone here must have built one of these before???

[walterdude]

As a suggestion you could give a shout-out to forcedfirebird, or betterthanyou... They are a couple of iron-head guys and know what goes into a swap.. There are others, but, those are the only ones I can think of right now....
Good luck and keep us posted on progress,,, I LIKE what I'm reading!!!
Tom....

[bszopi]

Ben (SappySE107) pointed out a few flaws I had in the above setup, mainly the crappy quench, and that a 272 grind is on the low end of what is needed for that CR. So, I started playing around with some other configurations and came up with something I think you will like. Start with a 3400 block (a 3.4 block out of a Camaro would work as well), and install a 2.8 crank along with 3.4DOHC pistons. Then slap on some 3500 heads and topend. This will result in a displacement of 3028cc (your limit is 3088cc, correct?) and a CR of 11.89, with a quench of 0.05" (0.35-0.45" is optimum). Get a 272 or higher type grind, and you should definitely make some good power (once its tuned, of course).

[ForcedFirebird]

Y'all know what I'm going to say

Only problem I see with the 2.8 block is the flat top pistons, I don't ever recalling them having a dish, but then again, you have to take deck height into consideration. The 3.4 has the jugs .010" down in the hole and .045" head gaskets.

[sureshot007]

Y'all know what I'm going to say

Only problem I see with the 2.8 block is the flat top pistons, I don't ever recalling them having a dish, but then again, you have to take deck height into consideration. The 3.4 has the jugs .010" down in the hole and .045" head gaskets.

I have no idea what that means. Are you saying that it will work, or that it won't work?