Ordering new camshaft tonight.

[Bouncer88]

I am looking at comp cams part number 16-233-4 and I was wondering would it be ok to install just the camshaft? I am also ordering 1.6 rr as well and was wondering what else I should buy for the install if anything?

[2.8-350TBI]

Make sure you install new lifters; new cams dont like used lifters

[Rootie524]

you could get away with stock lifters as long as you put new stronger TCE lifter springs in them (from WOT tech)

i didnt look into the cam your looking at or anything so idk what the lift and stuff is..but just from personal experience and building a dependable engine. get custom length pushrods, and stiffer valve springs as well.

[bszopi]

you could get away with stock lifters as long as you put new stronger TCE lifter springs in them (from WOT tech)

i didnt look into the cam your looking at or anything so idk what the lift and stuff is..but just from personal experience and building a dependable engine. get custom length pushrods, and stiffer valve springs as well.

IIRC, he has an older engine (in a S-10?), so its not a roller cam. Therefore, he needs to install new lifters.

[Rootie524]

ohhhhhh ok. gotcha. then disregard my post. my b

[Bouncer88]

Ya it is an 86 2.8 s10.

[pocket-rocket]

IIRC, he has an older engine (in a S-10?), so its not a roller cam. Therefore, he needs to install new lifters.

Don't flat tappets usually come with new lifters, though?

[60dgrzbelow0]

P-R... Flat Tappets ...ARE ... Lifters

Have a look at my photobucket for the additional images of the parts and part numbers that should be added to your list of needed components to do this job completely :

http://s557.photobucket.com/albums/ss19/60dgrzbelow0/GM34LNEWENGINEPARTS/?start=0

If this is your first experience with installing a new flat-tappet hydraulic camshaft (non-roller camshaft design) ...please understand that from the moment you start your engine after re-assembly and completion of the work... it is imperative that you maintain a level rpm of 2,000...with no idling of the engine below that level... for at least 25 minutes. Hopefully ... you will have coated the lobes of the camshaft with the proper camshaft lubricant that will come from CompCam and that you will have submerged the new lifters in a clean can filled with either Valvoline Racing Oil (High ZDDP content) or Royal Purple Engine Break-In Oil and purged all the air from their internals by plunging down with a push rod...and then thoroughly coated them down with either a Molybdenum-D--Sulfide Grease or the CompCam Camshaft Lube. Your Cam Kit should also contain a small bottle of a Break-In additive that must be added to your Engine Break-In Oil. This may all seem ridiculous in the extreme...but if you are cavalier or careless about this process... you run a high risk of wiping some of those lobes and destroying the camshaft before the Zinc and Phosphate and other metal coatings can coax the new camshaft lobes into work-hardening enough and toughening them up to provide you with a long life of service. After the initial 25 Minute Break-In period... make certain to change your Oil and Oil Filter...as the filter will have become clogged up with Moly-D by then. Fill the crank case again with another batch of Engine Break-In Oil and the necessary Camshaft Lubricant Additive and run this mix for another 500 mile break in period. Do this again at 1,500 Miles in the same manner and when 3,000 miles come around, you can switch over to Mobil 1 and a Mobil 1 Oil Filter. Don't use any Racing Oil high in ZDDP after that ...as you run the risk of coating your O2 sensors and Catalytic Converter with Zinc...rendering them useless. JFYI...what happens when using the ZDDP...is that the microscopic metal particles in the break in oil are squeezed in between the camshaft lobes and the smooth face of the hydraulic lifters and chemically harden the unusually soft steel they are both made out of... making them hard enough to resist early wear and tear through innumerable turns and lifting cycles. You might consider adding in a Cloyes "True" Roller Timing Set with your other camshaft upgrades...as this will seriously reduce the normal friction that occurs in the stock GM Timing Set and perhaps give you a slight bump in HP. Check out my other Photobucket Albums for more information on how this is done... including one dedicated to the Cloyes TS job. Good Luck with this upgrade...

[WrathOfSocrus]

Don't flat tappet CAMS usually come with new lifters, though?

fixed

P-R... Flat Tappets ...ARE ... Lifters

This is the exact 'letter of the law' stuff that I mentioned earlier. When people can't get along and argue moot points when you know (or at least should know) the gist of what someone is saying it scares people off. I know I spent as much time as I possibly could learning and reading here before ever making a post because I saw how people just get straight up eaten alive for no reason. I bet I have written, and then deleted, 5 or 6 times as many posts as I put up simply because either I knew people would continue to argue and ignore my point, or it had already been said and no amount of re-explaining was going to change the direction of the thread.

Back to the question - Not always. It is usually best to buy the complete kit with lifters and springs since you need new lifters with a flat tappet cam and proper springs for the cam design. There are individual cams that can be bought, and with a lot of those having very mild profiles and usually say 'computer compliant' or the like, the people who don't know about what cams fit what application or don't understand tuning will opt for that type of cam. Basically the people who are 'in the know' will get what they need and others will struggle trying to match up parts. Also, if you purchased a custom profile cam from a company they might not supply everything to support a 60* cam since it isn't a common build.

[pocket-rocket]

Yes, that was a typo on my part. I know flat tappets themselves are lifters, but being on the subject of cams I assumed people know I was talking about a flat tappet cam

I do know that flat tappet lifters shouldn't be re-used after removal unlike roller lifters and, like Wrath mentioned, there are kits with the cam and tappets (my point in my previous post), but I wasn't aware about the springs that go along with cam design as far as flat tappets goes. I learned something today

[WrathOfSocrus]

Any cam should have a manufacturer recommended open and closed spring pressure based on lift and duration. Upgrading to a stiff spring on a stock cam would be mostly pointless and probably do more harm than good. At the same time a large lift cam designed for higher RPM use would likely end up with valve float issues if you left the stock springs in. You would want to base your spring choice by the cam not the other way around.

[SappySE107]

This is the exact 'letter of the law' stuff that I mentioned earlier. When people can't get along and argue moot points when you know (or at least should know) the gist of what someone is saying it scares people off. I know I spent as much time as I possibly could learning and reading here before ever making a post because I saw how people just get straight up eaten alive for no reason.

Is this necessary? You make 1 post in this thread and it barely has anything to do with the topic. If someone has a problem, they can talk to an admin or mod. If you want to share how you feel, start your own thread in off topic. It does not belong in here with the assumption someone knows what the hell you are talking about from some other thread(s). I certainly have no idea where this stems from.

[geoffinbc]

If you have an old S-10 then order COMP Cams kit K 16-233-4 the K kit will get you all the parts you need for a proper cam swap. Don't try and short change yourself by compromising on the parts you need to install a new cam or you will just be digging into it later to fix something.

Also you can order the 1.6 Magnum rockers in a kit with pushrods if you old ones show signs of wear.

[60dgrzbelow0]

P-R....Wrath... My apologies... My "Tappet" comment fell flat only because P-R knows me ...and knows that while I strive for accuracy in my replies as much as possible, I never try to "Seperate Fly Sh*t from Pepper"... especially with someone whom I admire (Pocket-Rocket) more than my poor words can say. I am sorry that this is such a point of friction amongst any of us... I just assumed P-R would catch my comment as it was meant... in jest...rather than as any real criticism on a point of precision. Worse than that is that my innocuous jab at P-R has served to drive the OP's curiosity into "The Private Message" mode...and moved the dialog off of the forum where it can do the most good. I'm sorry Fellows... I'll be more thoughtful in the future. Here is what the PM entailed on this matter:

Camshaft info

First of all thanks for the informative post! Second I have a question about keeping the engine at 2000 RPM. You stated do not go below that number of RPMS (2,000) but what if I go higher? I am just curious as to what the answer might be.

There is no reason to raise the rpm higher to get the necessary effect of trapping enough of the ZDDP laden motor oil between the rolling friction surfaces of the camshaft lobes and the flat surfaces of the hydraulic lifters. At precisely 2,000 RPM, the effort of the contacting metal-to-metal surfaces induce an un-Godly amount of frictional pressures that would ordinarily break down of "wipe" the lobes right off of the camshaft because the metal is so soft without the ZDDP protection. This is the critical RPM to attain and maintain for a minimum of 25 Minutes... so try not to imagine that raising this level will make things happen either sooner or make for a better outcome. Please ensure that you leave the radiator cap open and as soon as you start to see water vapor emerging after the first few minutes or better with increased revolutions and advise your "Spotter" to top off the radiator with the proper mix/color/flavor of good 50/50 mixture of water and anti-freeze and then cap it tightly. Please make damned sure you have checked and double checked all your fluid/oil/transmission fluid levels so that nothing goes wrong once you initiate your break in process. Take a "Wind Up Egg Timer" and set it for 30 Minutes on the dash board, and you can shut down the motor no later than after running the engine for thirty minutes ...tops. Keep a fire extinguisher on hand and have a reliable friend to act as your "Under-The-Hood Spotter" to eyeball the motor on all sides for any fuel/water/oil leaks that would prompt an emergency shut down prematurely to completing the minimum 25 Minutes for the camshaft break in period. If you have not asked these questions in your primary post as well as in this private message... just know that it is customary to list EVERYTHING related to your original question/post so that other users can benefit from this side bar conversation. I will take care of it for you this time... but in the future...please keep everything germane to the subject active in your entire posts... even if you think that your questions seem either naive or uncomfortable... as far as we are concerned... the only stupid questions are the ones that are either never asked...or asked when its too late to help somebody...

[Bouncer88]

Ok last thing, I can cancel the order now if I wish, would ordering a roller cam be better off?