New member looking for advice on 3.4L/3500 hybrid.

[carbon]

My hybrid top-end swap is temporarily on hold until I can afford Megasquirt and a TCI trans controller (about $1200 all told).
Thanks!

Why not use the MS-GPIO board? It was developed for transmission control with the 4L60e or are you using a different tranny now? Heck of a lot cheaper than 1200 bucks...

[TechRod]

@60dgrzbelow0
The 88 S10 4x4 oil pan fit the engine and the car perfectly.
Thanks, I'll try to find some time this weekend to upload my pics and vids to photobucket.

@carbon
I still plan on using the 4L60E trans and if the MS-GPIO board is mature enough to use on a day-to-day basis then I may reconsider it. When I started this build they were still developing (toying) with it. Sadly I just don't have the expendable income in the near future for an engine management system and tranny controller. Right now I'm wiring up the original OBD 1.5 system, and wanting to remove all non-essential wiring. I'm just not sure what can be removed without causing error codes or forcing the ECU into "limp home mode".

[TechRod]

I've been trying to use my Facebook page for the photos but the pics are there sometimes and not there at other times.
Here is a link to my build on Facebook.

Album 1 (maxed out at 200 pics)

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2032642&id=1228201666&l=e7d9457339

Album 2 (build continuation)

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2041851&id=1228201666&l=b610769654

I plan on setting some time aside this weekend to get all my pics and vids uploaded and organized on photobucket in hopes that they are more reliable.

[TechRod]

I've been working on alot of the little details lately since the weather turned nice. I'm not using the big cast aluminum stock accessory brackets since I'm not using the A/C or P/S, so I ordered and installed the alternator mount kit here http://www.britishcarconversions.com...category_id=28

I've recently mounted the PCM, alarm siren, vapor canister, surge tank, low pressure pump, about half of the fuel hoses (stainless braided), etc.
In the next couple of days I plan on finishing the fuel hoses, and installing the radiator and hoses, heater hoses, and tranny lines (all stainless braided). Then I need to mount a coolant overflow tank. I saw one in the junkyard in a little 4 door geo that looked like it could be used just about anywhere, very universal OEM looking. Looked to be just the part for this, gonna have to go back and grab it. I would already have it if I had a 10mm wrench the day I took my brother to the junkyard.
I also need a coolant temp sensor, cuz the old one was broken during the engine transplant. Say, those can go in either head, right?
One thing I'm not sure about is the oil level and oil pressure senders. Hopefully the PCM doesn't throw a code or refuse it to start due to the oil level sender not being present, any way to bypass? I'm using a 4x4 oil pan without a bung for it. As for the oil pressure sender, the gigantic one from the 94 Camaro donor won't fit in the Chevette's engine bay. Is there another oil pressure sender I could use?
Thanks

[ForcedFirebird]

Low oil level only triggers a light on the dash. As far as the oil pressure sender, you can use any 1/4" npt fitting and get it to either angle another direction to fit (with a 45 degree, 90 degree fitting etc) or you could even use some piping and mount it remotely.

[TechRod]

Thats good news about the oil level sender, glad to know fuel and spark wont be disabled due to it. I'll definitely use whatever hardware necessary to try and relocate the oil pressure sender, I was also wondering if any other models used a smaller compatible sender to use in its place.
Thanks ForcedFirebird

[Guest]

If you're not planning on any forced induction, I would look at using a '7427 PCM (and similar) from a '93 to '95 Chev pick up. These in stock configurations have been used to run the 4L60E and 4L80E.

With a souple simple little hardware changes it can run MPFI as well. Some tuning is needed and some changing to spark reference angles and settings will need to be made to run DIS, but not overly difficult to do.

This is the same ECM I am installing and have had run (still working on some unrelated bugs), my grandfather's '71 Chev pick up (which is highly modified BTW), using Corvette Crossfire induction, and a 4L60E, which is not yet installed. It still has the TH350 installed until I can get it running enough to drive it to work or a friends shop and put it up on the hoist, to swap the trannies.

The tuning aspect has been well documented, as well as running MPFI, on thirdgen.org in the DIY PROM section.

This would be a much less expensive method to get full tunability, and control everything through a single PCM.

I use an Ostrich to tune my vehicles and won't go without one now. I actually have one semi-permanently installed in my Datsun (also a GM ECM, running the Nissan I6, with DIS), and one that I use to tune other vehicles. I'll be picking up a 3rd Ostrich to semi-permantly install in my truck (1985 GMC Jimmy), when I get it back together, or leave on my test bench. They are well worth the money.

I think I would also use the 3500 Top end if all out power is what you want. It seems though that using the 3400 UIM, port matched to the 3500 LIM might result in some better low end torque, due to the longer runner. If you have both they could be somewhat easily swapped between to see which you prefer.

Just to clarify a couple points on ignition and engine managment.
The Crank Position Sensor mounted in teh side of the 3.4 block, will work fine with the 660 DIS system as previously stated. This sensor is connected directly to the DIS ICM, and has no interaction with the ECM/PCM. The ICM is connected to the ECM/PCM through 4 wires, one to tell the ECM/PCM what the RPM of the engine is, one for the ECM/PCM to command advance of the timing, one to enable ECM/PCM timing control, and another is simply a ground reference. So whether you use an OEM ECM, ro an MS, this how it will be connected, other than the MS requiring a Relay for the tan/black wire to send 5V to the ICM and enable ECM/PCM timing control.

If you used MS, while it will control the GM DIS just fine, the popular DIS system to use with the MS seems to be the Ford EDIS system, DIYAutotune.com actually sells some universal trigger wheels. The ONLY advantage I can see with the Ford EDIS is that dwell is also controlled via the MS, where as the GM DIS ICM controls the Dwell and is not adjustable, which doesn't seem to be a problem, anyway. Just thought I'd mention it.

FWIW, I've looked at using MS since before they were available, back a decade ago, but the GM ECM, even just the OBD1, seems to be far more capable, and reliable. With the introduction of the MS3, I'm almost swayed, but since it still doesn't seem to have any vehicle speed functionality, even though there is mention of speed dependant boost control, I will continue with my GM ECMs. The only thing I like about the MS3 is that it has onboard datalogging capabilities, via an SD card. I haven't seen a price for it yet, but imagine it will be pretty pricey using the MS1 and 2 pricing as an idea. Still much more expensive than using a GM ECM/PCM, Ostrich and ALDL cable.

--==EDIT==--

I just found pricing on the MS3 and a full kit using the latest V3.57 board is over $500.