MMS Performance Package for 3400

[skinrock]

First off, I just want to say hi to everyone. I'm a pretty active member over at NAIOA, they always talk about this site, so I've lurked here a few times before. Hopefully I can save up some money and get the 62mm TB this summer.

Anyways, I posted a question over at NAIOA about the Milzy MotorSports performance packages. There were a couple different options I was considering. First was just getting a Stage 1 cam alone, which I understand plays the biggest role. Obviously the matching heads and manifold would only help, but if money were a factor...would it necessarily be a waste to just get a cam, or will I still see an improvement from that alone?

Obviously it would be ideal to get the entire package, but remember, this is still a street car, my daily driver. I'm just looking for things here and there that can be used in a daily driver, and get me performance you wouldn't normally see in a 3400.

Also, the main reason I came over here was because someone mentioned about getting the pushrods to go with this, he didn't go into details, just said to hop on over here and talk to you guys. He also mentioned some people experienced weird issues with the stage 2 products, so maybe I should just stick with stage 1 anyways.

So basically, I'm just wondering if a cam alone is a good buy, or if I should just wait it out and see if I can get the whole package. And also, are the custom pushrods necessary?

Thanks in advance.

edit: btw, I ran a quick search already, didn't really see anything specific to what I want.

[SappySE107]

MMS can no longer get cams made so make sure they have one in stock first.

[Superdave]

I'll keep my opnions on Milzy to myself but i can say that the stage 2 cam makes some decent power in a 3400. I wouldn't put the stage 2 in a DD though.

Check out the store here and see if you can piece yourself together a top end package, Ben has tons more cam options and actually has the specs plus actual flow sheets for his heads/top end parts.

Ben is a great guy to deal with (although he dosen't answer my PM's :P )

[skinrock]

hmm, looks like it's gonna get pretty technical then, lol. is there a recommended package for a street car, while trying to get a nice improvement over stock? I saw the custom heads in the store, but I don't really know what all the options are...I mean I kinda understand what they mean, but I don't know which ones are necessary or which choices are the most optimal.

Also, I didn't see any cams except a stock one, is that something I just talk to Ben directly about?

[SappySE107]

On the store main page, you will see the regrinds. For a street driven daily driver setup, the 1393 cam looks promising in simulations. As for head porting options, ill probably make an easier setup for picking out the options. I can put a package together no problem though. Id like to have MPRacing (mark) tune some package setups for me sometime. He is in illinois, near wisconsin so its not that far from michigan depending on your location. Just a thought.

[skinrock]

So according to those charts, the 1393 improves to 164 hp stock all the way to 200 hp with a street ported 3500 top end swap. When you get the top end swap, are the heads modified in any way similar to how you would mod stock heads for improvement, or are they stock (except for the porting option of course)?

I guess my question is...I know the 3500 top end is superior, but it seems like the ones in the swap are stock, vs. doing a custom job on the 3400 ones.

Also, if I did choose to do a 3500 top end swap, is there a better choice than the 1393 regrind?

Sorry if any of these sound silly...I'm doing my best to learn.

[SappySE107]

There really isn't much flow to gain from street porting over the mild porting I do for the top end swap. There are porting options, which is why the street port job is 150 more than the mild. It takes considerable detail/work to make them flow more for boost

For naturally aspirated engines, you want the best flow with the smallest cross section. The 3500 heads are a few cc bigger overall, but the cross section is smaller. Any ported 3400 setup is already at a disadvantage to the stock 3500 head from the start, and it takes a lot of flow to compensate (regain velocity). If you want more top end power, the larger ports of the 3400 intake will be great, so its also a matter of the powerband you want. I recommended the 1393 because it has the best usable powerband for a daily driver of the specs I have simulated. The 3500 top end would lend itself to the lower RPM use as well (2-6k).

The current swap kit is about to be changed to just the heads and manifolds with options. I appreciate the questions, as it lets me know exactly what you want to know and what you are looking for.

[skinrock]

Okay, hate to bring this back up, but basically I was looking to get a ZZP downpipe and PCM tune before I did this, however even though Zoomer keeps saying we can do it anytime, I can never seem to set up a weekend date to do it. So, I will be off during the first week of July, hopefully they will be open then, and I can do it during the week.

So back to this, I'm pretty happy with the numbers the 1393 can put out. I can't really afford a 3500 TES right now, so it won't be to the full advantage, but I think the cam alone will make me pretty happy. And it leaves open the option to do the swap and get even more power.

My only question is...will the 1393 be fine with everything stock? I have only done an FWI and the GMPP catback exhaust. I might order the downpipe, but just assume that won't happen till the PCM tune. Will I be safe doing this?

[SappySE107]

Of all the cams, the 1393 is the best suited for the stock engine. I wouldn't expect any issues, though tuning should always be considered.

[skinrock]

Sorry if I should already know this, but when you refer to tune, do you mean a tuned PCM or some other kind of engine tuning? If so, how much is that and where can I do it?

[SappySE107]

Computer tuning, and you would need to either talk to mpracing.org (mark) or get a dhp or hptuners setup to tune it yourself. That would be give you the most out of the cam anyway.