3400 vs 3500 top end swap simulation

[SappySE107]

These are simulated results from dynomation with pro tools. First are the stock 3400 numbers, then the stock 3400 with stock 3500 top end swap. Last is the 3500 top end swap with my ported manifolds. 56mm TB for 3400, 65mm for 3500 top end swap. 3400 exhaust manifolds were used for all exhaust flow numbers. Ill post up the specs of the stock 3400 so you can see all the information it spits out.




More about the software (dynomation) that I got these numbers from.

http://www.proracingsim.com/dynomationmainpage.htm

I will post the 65mm TB simulation on a stock 3400 as well.

[SappySE107]

That was using the wave form simulation. I will have to do the hybrid so you can see its wave form with emptying/filling modes blended. It might be closer to real world.

[SappySE107]

Here are the hybrid models. The wave form model as posted above gives a better looking chart. Filling and emptying is very jagged so when you combine them you get a jagged result. I have messed with the refinement settings and the number of wave cycles, which does make some interesting changes but its still go at least 1 major power change for 500 RPM. These numbers are using the same 8 wave cycles on rough in the program.

[3400-95-Modified]

Obviously these numbers are with optimal timing and fuel mixture and is not taking into consideration the crap we are delt with running a stock ECM... right?

[SappySE107]

Correct, its factored for 12.5:1 AF ratio for power (i guess for measuring the weight of the intake event).

[rickykline]

156hp 190tq is what i dynoed stock 3100 5sp...

[AaronGTR]

Very interesting numbers. Also interesting how all the peak HP and torque numbers appear between 4000-5000rpm then fall off rather sharply towards 7000 on the chart with the stock 3400 gear. The two with 3500 gear fall off somewhat less, but the peak power curve is still in the same area. I'm positive that is due to the use of the 3400 exhaust manifolds. It would be interesting to see the use of 3500 manifolds or headers and see how that shifts the curve and what new peak numbers it creates.

[wasas9]

yeah, i think those numbers are slightly skewed...even with slight tuning us stock 3400 guys are ranging from 176 WHP to 194 WHP...

[SHOoff]

yeah, i think those numbers are slightly skewed...even with slight tuning us stock 3400 guys are ranging from 176 WHP to 194 WHP...

Hopefully with the 3500 top end swap and ported manifolds like mentioned then will show a bit more whp than what's listed on the charts then too.

~250 at the crank has got to feel damn nice with no boost and such.

[SappySE107]

Show me a bone stock 3400 pushing 197 to the ground. No freakin way. Its 175 stock rated from GM at the crank. With tuning I can believe 185 range at best, perhaps 190, chp.

[SappySE107]

Get me some header dimensions and ill plug them in. The 3500 manifold doesn't line up well on my flowbench because it faces down. If you have a crossover type from manifold I can use, ill try it. I will have to find my rear and see if that clears it better. My initial front mani test peaked at 144 or so CFM vs the 156 for the 3400 manifold at .500 lift. I knew then that I didn't need to bother flowing with the obstruction at the pipe exit I had.

For header flow specs, i can just flow a test tube and get close to the same results.

[wasas9]

Whoops....*nearly bone stock*, only upgrade is an FFP underdrive and a CAI....at the V6z24 bash 88cavalierz24 did a 193 HP pull with FFP and a CAI and nearly the same for MrPaulo...

Brad91Z24 did a 180 HP with 220 torque with FFP, and 62 or 65 MM TB

We were all running chips made by Burn also..

[SappySE107]

That doesn't add up IMO. pulley give 6 whp or so I think, and the CAI can't be worth 20+ whp. Did anyone dyno stock?

[rickykline]

stock 3100 auto i did 130hp 150tq or so... been along ass time

[wasas9]

That doesn't add up IMO. pulley give 6 whp or so I think, and the CAI can't be worth 20+ whp. Did anyone dyno stock?

I was the closest to stock...stock air intake with just the underdrive, had the Multec 2s also. No VSS so that may have messed up some values and i also had a slight bog at lower RPMS...

here's my dyno sheet. Here is a link to the other bash dynos

http://www.v6z24.com/jbodyforum/viewtopic.php?t=85699&highlight=bash+dyno