oil pressure wont work!

[60dgrzbelow0]

k i've been doing some more thinking and i've decided i don't really wanna fill the cylinders up with oil and spin the motor over making a huge mess not sure if anyones seen my swap but it would be a damn shame to carelessly fling oil all over it

Flinging Motor Oil all over the place would be the least of your problems... With all that incompressible lubricant packed in every nook and cranny, if you do manage somehow to get the starter not to grind the teeth off the flywheel while trying to turn the motor innards, you'll be lucky if you don't either bend some conrods (yes ...even the forged ones in our little V6 engines WILL bend when forced against too much hydraulic pressure) or crack the engine block! The oil simply cannot escape fast enough through the open spark plug holes in the heads (assuming you removed them)...if not...you will be the first man in America to turn a GM V6 Motor into a "Hydraulic Pump". What are the chances of just getting some friends together and just yank the engine out and mount it on a stand so you can turn it upside down and CRC the Hell out of it?

[Firehawk94]

Hopefully he'll drain the 19 quarts of oil before he starts turning the engine over I like the priming tool that you made....any chance of you mass producing these things and selling them? You may be able to make a bit of profit if the price on the parts isnt too high to make it. In other words, I would be interested in one.

SR20 let us know how everything goes with your dilemma. I'm pretty sure that youll be fine. Our engines are made for the long haul.....I have two, one in a 94 Camaro and the other in a 94 Firebird. The camaros 3.4 has been knocking for 2 years and is still running strong!! The firebirds 3.4 has 245000 mi. on it and it doesnt tap or smoke at all! And it is my DD. The Camaro is parked and is the candidate for a rebuild and topend swap. So yea I'm sure your engine will pull out fine!!!

[60dgrzbelow0]

Building an Oil Pump Priming Tool for 60* Motors

Hopefully he'll drain the 19 quarts of oil before he starts turning the engine over I like the priming tool that you made....any chance of you mass producing these things and selling them? You may be able to make a bit of profit if the price on the parts isn't too high to make it. In other words, I would be interested in one.

Thanks for the inquiry but, not being a machinist or having access to 2.5" aluminum round stock, the hardened 8mm Hex Rod Stock and the metal lathes needed to shape it, it would be a daunting process to make them the way I had to do the first prototype "one off". But "patent infringement" risks aside, having done all the research on the parts and pieces while mixing and matching and grinding to get this one to work, I will be happy to soon share those dimensions and provide a "parts and pieces list". In advance of getting all these measurements, here is a baseline of the raw materials and procedures needed to make what the Auto Parts companies should have been making and selling years ago on our behalf: (OPPT = Oil Pressure Priming Tool)

If you want the visual "CLIFF NOTES" to this Step-By-Step Instructional... Visist my Photo Bucket site HERE:

http://s557.photobucket.com/albums/ss19/60dgrzbelow0/ANEWV6OILPUMPRIMINGTOOL/

(1) You will need to buy some type of standard, available Oil Priming Tool made for the SBC/90* Engines, just to get at it for some of its components. The one you choose MUST be of the style that has that odd shaped aluminum barrel at the top that closely matches the design of the upper portion of stock GM V6 Oil Pump Drive for the 2.8L. 3.1L and 3.4L engines. It also must have a metal center rod that is at least 3/8" in dimensions to allow for the extra material to be ground down for a close fit into the squared off fitting on the end of the shaft. These SBC Pre-Oilers can run anywhere from $30-$45 from RockAuto, Northern Auto Parts or Summit online parts catalogs.

(2) You will need an assortment of Hardened Steel Washers to use as segment separators and serve as thrust bearing surfaces along the length of the stock 3/8" steel shaft to align the parts in such a way that the PTFE or Black "O" Ring needed to seal the upper rear engine block from leaking can be aligned perfectly in the upper groove of the engine block, while the drill is working away on the 3/8" steel shaft in the center to build up oil pressure. Adding and subtracting washers helped find the right spot for the "O" Ring. These shafts come with various grooves machined in along the length of them with locking, high carbon spring steel rings that will all have to first be removed before installing the washers as space and distance adjusters.

(3) A decent bench grinder, along with a spray can of WD-40 to oil quench the 3/8" steel shaft every so often when it gets too hot from all that grinding needed to take the round 3/8" steel shaft down to the snug size of 3/8" SQUARE MALE END needed to plug the now shortened AND SQUARED OFF 3/8" Round Shaft into the base of an 8mm Socket. The 8mm Oil Pump Hex Rod then fits inside this socket when the Oil Pump Priming Tool is guided into the engine block Oil Pump Drive opening. This is where all of the real labor comes in by trial and error to get the length of the round 3/8" rod ground down and squared off...just right.

(4) Having an extra, stock GM 8mm Hex Shaft would help by allowing the builder to compare the new tool's over all length and the position of the machined aluminum barrel at the top for "O" ring alignment purposes when shown alongside the stock GM Oil Pump Drive with the 8mm Hex Shaft inserted all the way into the unit. When the intermediate parts of this thing are assembled, the 8mm Hex Shaft has to be a perfect match in length when pushed inside of the tool socket in order for it not to be too long or too short and risk having it coming out of the top of the oil pump female Hex receptacle and then dropping down inside the engine during the hectic oil pump priming process. all the "In Between" parts of this tool must not come loose and fall inside the motor. I was tempted to glomm some JB_Weld all over the tool around the shaft/socket interface, but in the end, I think TIG welding the 8mm Socket to the shaft will provide more security and stop the socket from popping off after having the 8mm Hex Rod rattling it from the inside. Having this arrangement allows for the Nylon Locking clip to be installed over the female Hex End in the Oil Pump along with a new, stock 8mm Hex Shaft when the pump is finally installed, bolted down and torqued to spec. One last consideration is making certain that the socket being chosen is NOT larger in diameter than the Hypoid gear on the stock Oil Pump Drive! (We don't want to damage the matching gears on the in-dwelling camshaft...)

The only thing the user of this new OPPT has to do is afterward, make certain that the Hex Shaft poking upwards from inside the engine block makes its way up inside the OPPT before full insertion and bolt down with the Oil Pump Drive Clamp at the very back of the engine.

(5) Don't rely on your "Spotter" to sit in the car and try to read the Oil Pressure from the dashboard Oil Pressure Gauge as fed by the PCM. You could attach an outside oil line through one of the engine oil gallery plugs, but it might be better to just take a little time to tap a small, threaded hole into the Aluminum Oil Filter Adapter and then attach an oil line tube with an Analog Oil Pressure Gauge. Autozone and other similar stores sell these components and the job is a fairly simply one to do. The plastic oil pressure line should be long enough to reach from the bottom of the engine block near the Oil Filter all the way out to the area of the fender where you can comfortably watch the gauge while priming the engine. You will want to see the new oil traveling up the slender oil tube and finally registering satisfaction in your smile as you feel the drill begin to labor while you watch and hope for a decent rise in oil pressure above 50 PSI. When you remove the oil line, use a good thread sealer (NOT Thread Locker) on the matching threaded plug that should replace it in the the newly threaded hole in the aluminum Oil Filter Manifold. Don't allow the sealer to get inside the Oil Filter Manifold as some of it could ooze into the oil line flow and wreak havoc with a blockage.

(6) You MUST use a sturdy enough drill to make this work! The 1/2" Drill is preferred, so avoid using a standard 1/4" or 3/8" drive, as this work requires a drill with Balls as Big as Church Bells! Initially, the drill will not feel much resistance as the air in the oil galleries and spaces between the bearing surfaces is compressed and finally displaced by new engine oil (hopefully mixed with some type of Engine Oil Supplement). But soon enough, the 1/2" Drill will begin to labor as the Oil Pump draws more and more new motor oil from the pan and encounters more and more resistance to the oil flowing through the system and wetting down all the things needing protection from metal to metal contact. Running the drill in 30-45 second intervals will allow you to watch the oil pressure rise and fall... and give the drill a chance to cool down in between. For new engine builds, with the valve covers off... you can see the oil that has flowed through the system coming out of the push rods and cascading over the valve train as an assurance of good flow service to the top end of the engine, too. (It's a Beautiful Thing...But BEFORE you start...make one last check on the oil level...and make certain that you pre-fill the best oil filter you can afford to the brim with fresh, high quality motor oil and let the filter paper inside soak up as much as possible before you screw the filter canister in into the adapter manifold.) Failing to be this fastidious can make the difference between having an engine that runs "Just Okay..." and suffers 10,000 miles of wear during the first few minutes of life while the motor was starved for lubrication... and an engine that will churn and burn with real power for 250,000 miles!

Well...sorry for the long-winded explanation... I promise to get all the measurements posted soon and the final write-up on this cool tool emailed to Brad (BSZOPI) ASAP!

(Please forgive the Thread Jack, sr20hardbody...Perhaps the Mods will move it to a proper place...Thanks!)

--==Bob==---

[sr20hardbody]

thanks for that explanation im glad this thread has brought valuable info

i'll make sure i'll drain all that oil before i turn it over cuz that would be a huge mess if the block cracked! lol

another thing i forgot to mention was my block froze during the winter i wasnt around and it had pure water in it and took me over a week to thaw it out. so talk about some serious abuse and neglect we'll see if it pulls through i didnt see any coolant mix with the oil and there wasnt any leaks so hopefully that parts good.

also i was using the old 3100 starter and it finally went out so i'll need a new 3400 starter and battery to get any further and the subframes is out is it safe to start the motor with only the side mounts? they're fully window welded

[60dgrzbelow0]

New and final design for the oil pump priming tool

I like the priming tool that you made....any chance of you mass producing these things and selling them? You may be able to make a bit of profit if the price on the parts isn't too high to make it. In other words, I would be interested in one.

All New and Updated Photos/Parts images can be found here:

http://s557.photobucket.com/albums/ss19/60dgrzbelow0/ANEWV6OILPUMPRIMINGTOOL/

Okay... After re-configuring and simplifying the design and building the best model of the Oil Pump Priming Tool that I can create, I have completed the writing of a "HowTo" article on this matter and created a Photo-Display that shows the new potential builders of this "OPPT" as I have taken to calling it how it can be done and submitted everything to Brad bszopi, along with all the necessary, precise steps and materials required for the making of it ...and what it should look like when completed, for his editorial approval and posting on the main page. All measurements and product sub-parts and procedures are covered as completely as I thought possible. Please disregard any of my prior posts, instructions or images, as the newly designed one looks and functions quite differently from the prior design I offered. I am including three (3) of the four (4) images I sent along to Brad as an attachment to this post so that any other images already offered by me can be deleted in exchange for these. I hope the design for this device proves useful to all concerned.

--==Bob==--

[3400-95-Modified]

thanks for that explanation im glad this thread has brought valuable info

i'll make sure i'll drain all that oil before i turn it over cuz that would be a huge mess if the block cracked! lol

another thing i forgot to mention was my block froze during the winter i wasnt around and it had pure water in it and took me over a week to thaw it out. so talk about some serious abuse and neglect we'll see if it pulls through i didnt see any coolant mix with the oil and there wasnt any leaks so hopefully that parts good.

also i was using the old 3100 starter and it finally went out so i'll need a new 3400 starter and battery to get any further and the subframes is out is it safe to start the motor with only the side mounts? they're fully window welded

This whole thread sounds like a complete disaster... from the start leaving the pan off and rusting the internals of the motor that bad, that's just carelessness there... I can't believe you spent that much effort making the bay look nice but neglect the important parts.

Also a frozen solid block over the winter... forget about it. Pull the engine, its done. 9 times out of 10 if a block has straight water in it and freezes solid you will crack the block and the freeze plugs wont help anything.

[Firehawk94]

Also a frozen solid block over the winter... forget about it. Pull the engine, its done. 9 times out of 10 if a block has straight water in it and freezes solid you will crack the block and the freeze plugs wont help anything.

I agree......somewhat. The 94 bird that is pictured in my sig has 244000 mi. on it when I bought it it had a blown freeze plug because it sat over the winter with no antifreeze- just water. Check out my cardomain page theres the proof, username: firehawk94. It didnt blow the plug out it just started leaking like crazy, I changed the freeze plug filled it with coolant and I havent had trouble out of it since.

I have to agree though...why spend so much time and money on the engine and leave the oil pan off?? Well, somethings just happen I guess all we can do is suggest to the man things he can do to solve his problem and I dont think "pull the motor" is the answer he is looking for just yet which Im not saying it wont come down to that. Let him exhaust his options first because you just never know with these things.

[sr20hardbody]

well i didnt really mean for any of this to happen lol the engine was swapped in a long time ago and idled and sounded clean! i just never got to drive it cuz the interior wasnt finished. then all of a sudden when i was working on it one day and had it running that oil pump drive gear popped outta the block cuz there was no bracket holding it down i didnt even know anything about it untill i found it after it was too late running with no oil pressure. the junkyard i got the motor from musta took it off or something.

so thats what lead to the issue of using straight water and rusty bottom end is my pump drive gears bracket was missing and its 2 years later so the j/y warrantys up. i just have to get it going again and hope its not that bad.

[sr20hardbody]

update

k i primed the oil pump with the extension i have and a rag to cover the opening and i believe the system is primed good.

so i pulled all spark plugs and added a tiny bit of oil to each cylinder and i mean just a couple drops. then i turned the motor over slowly by hand cuz it was a little hard at first but everything musta lubed up quickly cuz it got really easy to spin about 1/2 a crank turn i could spin it and keep it spinning.

meanwhile theres still 18 quarts of oil in it thats why i turned it over by hand and oil gushed outta cylinders 3 and 4 only!! does this mean the rings are no good in those cylinders? the oil squirted outta those spark plug holes pretty far! the rest of the spark plug holes didnt have any oil coming out of them. could it also be cuz cylinders 3 and 4 are in the middle and have a higher chance of squirting out this oil?

[Firehawk94]

Well, you have to figure....you have 18 qts of oil in your crankcase it has to go somewhere!! lol I think youll be fine. Put it all back together and let her run!!

[sr20hardbody]

k thats good to hear!

next step is to get a 3400 starter and battery i'll let everyone know once it arrives

[3400-95-Modified]

You’re going to be fogging for mosquitoes when that thing fires up...

Make sure when you drain the oil out you then turn the engine over a few times with the starter attached, and NO plugs in it... Get the remaining oil out of those cylinders; otherwise you'll hydro lock your motor with oil!

[torq455]

exactly....the 3 or 4 cylinder oil squirt may have been due to the excessive oil fill level and those pistons may have been sitting lower. i wouldn't worry too much at this point.

[60dgrzbelow0]

You have just GOT to get a video of this thing when you're all buttoned up and ready to "light the candle" on this project... and post it right back here...

[sr20hardbody]

i'll for sure make a vid of this thing starting up i bet its gonna make all kindsa noises at first! as for posting it i never posted a vid before online hopefully its as easy as posting pics lol