TC Stall Speed for 4T60E

[big_news_1]

I'd like to know if there are any 245mm converters from 4T60E applications (or any other valid applications) that are stalled in the 2800-3500 range from the factory. My Bonneville's converter stalls somewhere between 1800-2200, and I'm looking for a bolt-on replacement that stalls higher. Any help would be greatly appreciated!

[sil]

you can talk to a transmission parts store and tell them about the converter with gm code Fa*B thats a 2795 stall



1st Digit (application trans)

F -- 125C, 440-T4, 4T60, 4T60-E
2nd Digit (approx stall (depends on engine)

A -- 2795 rpm
B -- 2560 rpm
C -- 2385 rpm
D -- 2095 rpm
E -- 1865 rpm
G -- 1630 rpm
H -- 1515 rpm
J -- 2060 rpm
K -- 2760 rpm
L -- 1895 rpm
M -- 1525 rpm
Y -- 1420 rpm
Z -- 2375 rpm
3rd Digit (TCC clutch material)

0 -- Clutch omitted by factory
5 -- Clutch contains poppet valves
All other digits (pre 1996):

Red Fiber material
1996-97

C, E, H, K, P -- Carbon filled clutch
1998-up

F, H, K, Q -- Woven graphite clutch
4th Digit (Clutch Type)

B -- standard
C -- viscous (stay away from these type)

[big_news_1]

Thanks for the good info! I'm not sure those stall speeds are quite as high as I would like. Does this basically mean that there are no stock GM applications with a TC stall above 2795?

[big_news_1]

More specifically, were there any Grand Ams, Skylarks, Grand Prixs, etc. with the 3100 or 3400 that had a 3000 stall 245mm TC?

[sil]

gm put higher stall torque converters into smaller powertrains like 2.0L ect..
now form what i believe, torque converters stall higher with the more power your engine puts out
not sure how much higher but im guessing that when you put on the 2795 stall tc in a nice power plant that its gonna be like 3000 rpm stall. or it could be as little as 2850 ect..
im just guessing at the numbers though

not sure what make/year/model cars came with what tq

[Joseph Upson]

Make sure you do your homework, the 4 cylinder cars usually have a highway cruise speed above the torque converter stall, so you will certainly need to be concerned about fluid temperature because as mentioned the stall increases along with the engine torque. I used a converter from a turbo pontiac sunbird that has the 2700+ stall on a 3.4L in a fiero and was able to smoke the tires easily despite the high degree of traction from having the engine in the back that multiplies on acceleration.

My 5 spd TPI 350 Fiero would not spin the tires without considerable more effort despite having around 100 lb/ft more torque, and since the 3.4L was bolted to a 4spd automatic the weight difference over the rear wheels between the cars was not that great.

[sharkey]

a 4 cyl will have a higher cruise speed, but you have to remember that even with a higher stall converter on the freeway you will be at the same rpm as with a lower stall converter because of the lockup clutch. when engauged, the lockup clutch basicly locks the crankshaft to the input shaft. stall speed has no effect of cruise rpm because of lockup

[big_news_1]

From what I understand, Sharkey is correct. As long as I get a converter that retains the lockup feature (and I'm sure all GM's late model vehicles have converters with lockup), the stall speed should have no effect on my highway driving. Thank you for the the input, though.

Anybody else know stock TC stall speeds? I have a report from a Grand Prix owner that the 97 Grand Prix GT with L36 were shipped from the factory with a 3000 stall converter. That seems awfully high to me, so I'm looking for someone else to corroborate the facts. I appreciate the replies!

[Joseph Upson]

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Archives/Archive-000001/HTML/20060811-2-070109.html

I posted this sometime ago, it might help some

The best source for this information is a full line transmission parts store they are more familiar with the codes probably more so than a rebuilder. You will still need to look into a good transmission oil cooler with a stall in the range that you are considering because a lot more heat will be generated especially around town. I would also do a little more research into the possibility that the higher stall speed may be able to affect the strength of lock up due to some slipping problems I had on a turbocharged engine. You may find that you don't have to increase stall speed as much as you intend to in order to get the desired effect.

I rebuilt a few automatics but never researched the lock-up mechanism to see how it works. I do recall some parts guys expressing some concern over the amount of stall I wanted to use on a 4T40 so just make sure your assumptions are correct.

I doubt very seriously GM put anything on a six cylinder with a stall near the 3000 range, it wouldn't be good for gas mileage and would be too easy to spin the tires. From the tranny books I have seen V6 and above almost always received a converter under 2000 stall and the bigger the engine the lower the stall.

[big_news_1]

Thank you for the excellent information, Joseph! I'll take a look at some of my options, then try to choose a converter that will be right for my application. My L36 is making a little over 190hp at the wheels, so this isn't any crazy build-up or anything.... yet . Perhaps something in the 2500-2800 range would be more appropriate.

[sil]

tell ya with my 2795 stall i barely notice it, so dont expect the big uber drag car feel lol

[big_news_1]

tell ya with my 2795 stall i barely notice it, so dont expect the big uber drag car feel lol

At what speed does the converter actually stall in your application? Do you know what kind of power and torque you're putting down? Thanks.

[sil]

never took my car to a dyno so i really have no idea

you will notice it transition into upper rpms quicker
more positive feel
youll like it
it just wont have that high revs when barely stepping on gas feel, it'll feel better than stock though forsure

but if you want drastic muscle car feel, then go with like 3500+++ stall lol

[big_news_1]

but if you want drastic muscle car feel, then go with like 3500+++ stall lol

Lol.... 3500 would get me into the power immediately, but I think it's a bit extreme for my application

So you're not sure of an approximate RPM where your TC stalls? Is it right around 2800, or is it a bit higher or lower? IIRC, the more power pushed through a TC, the higher the actual stall speed will be.

[sil]

im still in the tuning process...so i havnt done any harsh launch testing or dynos or anything, just drivin around.

if you want people to say... holy sh*t what stall tc ya got, then go 3500+
cause i doubt anyone will notice the stall difference with the 2795
with the 2795 its not like your motor revs to 2795 and then all the sudden catches....

ack... im sorry i wish i could tell you forsure what my numbers are

maybe someone else with a high stall will pipe-in soon :P