Question : Brake line sizes?

[Schmieder]

1996 Grand Prix SE (W-Body)

What size are the brake line fittings? -3AN or -4AN?

What size is the hard line for the brakes?

It appears the threads for the FR RL RR FL connections at the ABS motor (connected to the Master Cylinder) are of two types. One thread depth is longer then the other.

Anyone know what sizes they are? I need to replace the brake lines (rusted out and the RL now developed a pin leak)

If I replace just the lines, I suppose I could use the original fasteners and just flare the new lines myself.

[pocket-rocket]

I'm not certain what -AN size the fittings are. I normally take the old ones with me and match them at the store. The hard line is almost always 3/16" on smaller vehicles, like our W's. Before you go for reflaring stuff, be sure to check the length of the line for heavy rust or weak spots so you don't end up doing what I did once, which was fix a leak, stab the pedal as hard as you can when done and create another leak. At that point, every brake line on the car got replaced, but at least a Ford Festiva is so small, it doesn't require much brake line, lol.

[Schmieder]

I figured I can reuse the original fasteners. Since the 3/16 steel line isn't very expensive for 25' I should replace all 4 like you said you did.

Now, the tool, people saying I should avoid cheap flaring tools like the plague. Meh, I'm going to rent it to save money I don't have, lol.

All 4 brake lines, while I'm at it, if I have enough maybe the fuel return line will get replaced as well.

Thanks

[pocket-rocket]

You can reuse the flare nuts, but just don't round them off while removing them. Use a flare wrench. It wraps around the nut to make more surface contact so you don't round them off as easy.

The rental tools at the parts store are going to be the same $30 trash ones they sell, so don't rent one from there. Also, make a couple test flares on the old line before moving on to flaring the good stuff, that way you get a feel for the process. It's not hard, but those flares can mean the difference between the car stopping and having no brakes with you and your family in the car some day. I actually had a friend come up a few weeks ago and thank me for the brake line work I did on his car a few months ago after he had to make an emergency stop and no lines popped (the original reason why I had to replace all the lines on his car).

You will also need a tubing cutter to get the flare nuts off the original lines and to cut the new ones. You can use other things to get the nuts off, but you won't want to use anything but a tubing cutter to cut the new lines since they need to be almost a perfect 90 degree cut to get a good flare.

This is my kit, not real cheap, but not real expensive and works like a charm:

http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/GENERAL-Double-Flaring-Tool-3ZH04?Pid=search

Oh, also if you get one that isn't at a parts store, MAKE SURE it's a 45 degree kit, not 37. A 37 degree flare might look like it would work, but it won't seal like it's supposed to and could cause a leak. As you can tell, I don't play around when it comes to brakes since I hold those peoples lives in my hands when they bring their car to me for brake work, and I don't want an accident I caused by shoddy work on my conscience.

[Schmieder]

You share the same values I have regarding safety. No ones life is worth the short cut. And I will have my Wife and kids in the car at times too.

I did consider patching the lines but I quickly tossed that idea out the door for the very reasons discussed. I know brake lines can see up to 3,000 psi during emergency braking. I also decided to keep the ABS system and just wire in a switch into the ABS fuse circuit. So I can turn ABS on/off at leisure. Sometimes we may want to lock up the wheels.

Your advise regarding the brakes is very much appreciated.

I heard the rear brakes on the 96 GP were flawed and had a recall? I noticed the rear brakes eat the pads up too fast. My inspection station, I have lifetime warranty on the rear brakes and only pay labor. It's worth the peace of mind.

I now consider this brake line busting a good thing. It brought the age of the brake lines to my attention now instead of on the road trying to stop in time. And now, after the initial anger realizing the busted line, I feel grateful. Especially to receive such good advise. Because this is a big learning experience for me. This car is the first car I ever decided to repair and mod stuff myself.

In fact, the lines are the only thing left that is original besides the calipers (which will be replaced someday). As of last year, I have new rotors, pads, flex lines and master cylinder.

I am going to purchase the flare tool you recommended. At least I know I can get a known good tool w/o going for the really pricey ones.

Thanks guys