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**geoffinbc** · 07-09-2006, 09:14 PM

You can use the 3.4L timing cover but it does not have a pointer to set timing. But you can always set timing by using a Vacuum guage. All Harmonic balancer are neutral balance regardless of how the engine was balanced. The Flywheel must be a nutral balance flywheel from 88 or later.

Your engine must have ran low on oil.

**TurtleMechanic** · 07-10-2006, 05:03 AM

Thanks,
How to ID the flywheel for Nuetral balance?And a stock 91 2.8 harmonic balancer should work?Cool thanks for info I have lot's of work to do before I get the block etc.
Am trying to round up some parts as I go.

**TurtleMechanic** · 08-02-2006, 05:28 AM

Started teardown of both motors,found out what I believe happened to the one in the Trooper.

When engine was swapped in originaly,they rebuilt the 3.4 and used the 2.8 oilpan(extremely deep 3x deeper than camaro pan) but they used the camaro
oil pump pickup and the 2.8 oildipstick.

I spoke to the previous owner last night and he mentioned he had just changed the oil,after a long trip.(he had only owned it for 2 months).I asked him how much oil he put in it,he responded with like 4.5 qts or so,the dipstick was good.He said it drain'd alot more out of it though.The engine ran for about a week,DD to work.

I looked at the dipstick and it had another set of marks ground into it

so in all theory when the last person changed the oil they basically killed the engine from a lack of oil availible to the oil pump.

TFH
TurtleMechanic

**SappySE107** · 08-02-2006, 07:50 AM

Yikes, thats a heck of a combo to do. Kinda surprised whoever built that didn't correct the oil pump pickup instead of grinding a mark in the dip stick. Actually I guess im not.

**geoffinbc** · 08-07-2006, 10:14 PM

Ohwell shit happens. Make sure you get the right parts this time. Use your oil pan, dipstick and dipstick tube.

**Canyonero** · 09-01-2006, 10:57 AM

I have a stock 1990 Trooper with a 2.8L, and a complete 3.4L sitting in the driveway. I aim to make them one. My goal is to keep the 3.4L as camaro-like as possible, keeping the MPI system, front cover and accessories. Good to know about the oil pan/dipstick/pickup issue. I'd hate to blow my new engine!

**Ed_Mc.** · 09-03-2006, 09:44 PM

Maybe they killed it from Too Much oil, not too little. The 2.8 or 3.4 with Trooper oil pan (which is essentially only an S-10 4X4 oil pan anyway) only holds 4.5 quarts with filter (and that's using the H-D longer filter which holds more oil).

If the P.O. was saying that usually a lot more oil came out, maybe they were overfilling and the oil was getting all 'frothed up'. That certainly can't be good for the bearings! At any rate, no telling if the motor had been properly gone thru before it was installed in the Trooper.

BTW it's correct to use the oil pan that came with the original 2.8 in the Trooper, also to use that dipstick. And using the 3.4 oil pump is good.

But in re-reading your post I see they used the shallower Camaro oil pickup? Not So Good!! They should have used a Melling 245S oil screen/pickup tube (NOTE: corrected the part # from the original post; 243S was wrong, 245S is the correct depth pickup. eam 9/19/06).

This fits the deeper 4X4 pan, plus it's 3/4" in diameter and is the proper press-fit into the 3.4's oil pump. They couldn't have used the 2.8's original pickup because earlier models were 5/8" not 3/4".

So, I'm thinkin' you're absolutely right about lack of oiling, just maybe for a number of reasons. I did this swap into my Trooper about 4 years ago; if you'd like more Isuzu-specific info just drop me a P.M. or an e-mail and I'll forward the files to you..........ed

**Canyonero** · 09-04-2006, 02:12 AM

Originally posted by Ed_Mc.

...I see they used the shallower Camaro oil pickup? Not So Good!! They should have used a Melling 243s oil screen/pickup tube.

Alright, so I can't use the Trooper pickup? Where can I get the Melling screen/pickup, will they know what I'm talking about at the local auto parts store?

**Ed_Mc.** · 09-04-2006, 09:17 PM

Originally posted by Canyonero

Alright, so I can't use the Trooper pickup? Where can I get the Melling screen/pickup, will they know what I'm talking about at the local auto parts store?

Well, the Trooper 2.8 pickup has the correct depth, but will probably be only 5/8" diameter.

The Camaro pump (with 3/4" diameter pickup tube) has more oiling capacity and you need to use that pump with the 3.4; so if the Trooper oil pump happened to have the larger pump you could use that pump/pickup.

Both Troopers I've done have had the smaller pickup and I just went down to my auto parts store and ordered the deeper one, then pressed it into the larger oil pump.

That Melling part # is good, so most any auto parts store should be able to look it up or an equivalent.

BTW you should inspect your oil pump for wear unless you're using a new one. You can get rebuild kits too. Pretty hard to tear it all back apart if the oil pump doesn't deliver good pressure!

**Canyonero** · 09-04-2006, 09:42 PM

My 3.4L supposedly has 70,000 on in, so not too high (my 2.8L is still running "strong" at 161k with good pressure).

I went to the local Napa, and they "couldn't" look up the Melling part without cross referencing the vehicle. I didn't think the Melling part was related to either of those vehicles, so I didn't press it. My prefered place was closed on Labor day, but I'll drop by tomorrow and ask.

Concerning the starter. I need to tap some new mounting holes on the left (drivers) side for the Trooper starter. The Trooper's bell housing won't allow me to use the Firebird's starter on the right side. Does anyone have a template/drawing/jig for the proper alignment of those holes and the bolt specifications (grade, length, thread, etc). Please only tell me if you're very sure, I don't want to drill into my engine and do it wrong - might take it to a machine shop just to be sure, I haven't tapped anything since High School. I imagine taking the whole engine in will be cumbersome though. I don't have a pickup - just the Trooper.

**Canyonero** · 09-04-2006, 11:21 PM

Found the Melling pickup at Summit Racing, ordering that now. Also ordered a stock clutch today. Couldn't justify the price for a Centerforce.

I was reading some S-10 conversion notes, said the power steering pump wasn't usable from the donor Camaro/Firebird. But, it also said they are externally indentical (pressure regulator different within), so don't think this will effect my project as the Trooper's pump appears to have all the threads associated with the 3.4's mounting.

Perhaps my project should be broken off to it's own forum thread? Any moderators out there have a say?

**Ed_Mc.** · 09-05-2006, 08:48 PM

http://www.rodneydickman.com/n101.html for a starter mounting holes drilling fixture kit. $69 shipped and I'd expect pretty much foolproof.

Use all of the Troopers accessories; PS pump, alt, timing cover, intake/exhaust man's, smog pump, oil filter adapter. Use the 3.4's knock sensor but relocate it to the 2.8's location.

There's a mounting boss on the 3.4 that interferes with the Trooper oil filter adapter, you'll have to grind the boss to fit.

For a heavier-duty clutch, use one out of a 4WD 3.1-equipped Rodeo or P'up. The 3.1 Isuzu 4WD clutch disc is larger dia and has better holding power than the 2.8 clutch.

You may want to consider boring-out the stock 2.8 intake to accept a larger TBI, for now or for a future upgrade. Use a base gasket from a 1990 S-10 4.3 TBI as a template. I give a specific year 'cause the auto parts stores won't be able to figure it out otherwise!

You're going to want either a larger TBI, or you'll have to adjust fuel pressure/install larger injectors in the stock 2.8 TBI. The 'stocker' doesn't flow enough fuel in Open Loop and a 3.4 will lean-surge on cold startups unless you give it more fuel. You can also modify the 2.8's fuel pressure regulator for more fuel pressure but that's a Band-Aid at best. The larger TBI, with bored intake to match, gives the 3.4 a lot more performance.

I see from going back over one of your earlier posts that you were planning on using the Camaro SFI system, but that's quite a pain to rewire all that stuff and the TBI is very tuneable. I'd expect you get as much or more airflow from the larger TBI and bored intake as you will with a stock SFI. Don't know what the Camaro Dudes have to do to the SFI system to get more breathing but probably not as simple as with a TBI-system. I suppose you'd get more tractability with SFI and maybe slightly better MPG but you'll have to deal with the VATS and other issues if you re-wire the Trooper to suit.

It would be an interesting mod if you could make it work!

P.S. feel free to contact me on the Isuzu-specific stuff if you like, I can pretty much walk you thru this swap. With the good info available at this site, the S-Series.org forum, and what you can glean from the Isuzu forums at www.Planetisuzoo.com and www.4x4wire.com , this swap is almost a Slam-Dunk!

Cheers..........ed

**Canyonero** · 09-05-2006, 09:08 PM

Thanks for the input Ed. I bought a 4.3L TBI for the 2.8L years ago, never put it on... I took off some sensor that I wasn't supposed to and broke a screw while cleaning it. It was also my only rig and I didn'twant to take it down for the swap.

But now I have alternative transportation (my 1995 Suzuki DR350SE and my old man's '89 Trooper), and I already paid extra to get a 3.4L with ECU and wiring. I'm quite determined to make this work.

Already have or have ordered most the things I'll need. Clutch, higher pessure fuel pump, plugs and wires, oil pickup and gaskets. Still short an electric fan and some sort of air intake. What am I missing?

**Canyonero** · 09-05-2006, 09:08 PM

Server errored and posted that twice.

That jig is very appealing. Only need it once though... could always sell it off later and recover some of the investment - OR BUY ANOTHER V6!

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