Turbo Grand Prix 3500 swap

[bszopi]

Does anybody have a diagram of the lx9 trigger wheel? I have to figure out how to make megasquirt read the signal it's putting off. Does it have a notch every 6 degrees except for 2 to mark tdc or something like that?

Trying to find a picture of it, but you won't be able to use it with MS. It is a coded trigger, so each cylinder is a different pattern. Ok, here it is...



Here is a good thread discussing the trigger: http://60degreev6.com/forum/showthre...+crank+trigger

The ignition control module from a 3400 requires a 7x signal doesn't it?

Yes

[robertisaar]

jon, the 3400 ICMs(LA1 at least, i don't know if the last iteration of them used it or not) read the good old 7X reluctor that's been used in all of the 60V6 MPFI applications up until the 3500 came around and messed it all up.

then it sends a 3X signal to the ECM, which determines engine speed, which is all it needs for batch-fired injectors and waste-spark.

[Jonpro03]

Here is what I can find about compatible reluctor wheels.

http://megamanual.com/ms2/wheel.htm

http://www.megamanual.com/megatune.htm#si - the Ignition settings and the Trigger wheel setting sections


This is the section I was interested in

The trigger wheel settings are:

* Trigger Wheel Teeth (No_Teeth): is the nominal (include missing) teeth for wheel decoding. (0=no wheel decoding).
* Missing Teeth (No_Miss_Teeth): Number of consecutive missing teeth.
* Skip Teeth (No_Skip_Teeth): Number of teeth (between tach pulses) to be skipped. You must create the same number of 'tach' signals as you want ignition events. On a four cylinder four stroke engine, this is two per revolution. Suppose it has a 60-2 wheel. What you need to have happen is for MegaSquirt-II to 'skip' a certain number of teeth so the only the right number of teeth are counted as 'tach signals' per revolution. Since we have determined the number of tach signals we want is 2, we need to skip 60/2 = 30 teeth. For a eight cylinder 60-2, we need 4 ignition events per revolution, so we set skip teeth to 60/4 = 15. And for an eight cylinder 36-1 wheel, we would set skip teeth = 36/4 = 9.
* Delay Teeth (Delay_Teeth): Number of teeth to delay after 1st tooth after the missing teeth before 1st tach synch declared. You get synch as soon as you detect "first real tooth after the missing tooth". If that tooth is at TDC when it is detected, then there is 0 delay. If TDC doesn't occur until the next tooth is detected, then there is a delay of one tooth, and so forth.

[Jonpro03]

There is a ray of hope:

From: http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms2extra/...l.htm#features

I found this

Coil on plug: As above, but additional code is required to decode the trigger wheel.

There is hope yet...

[Jonpro03]

Robert are you able to pull up information on the LX9's ignition system? I'll take any info you can find.

I think it's waste spark coil on plug setup, just obviously not cop

[robertisaar]

i posted all the important bits already. what exactly are you looking for?

it's a waste-spark system that uses the PCM to control when the coils fire and the ICM just carries out those actions/commands. dwell is likely controlled via ECM pulse length as well.

[Jonpro03]

i posted all the important bits already. what exactly are you looking for?

it's a waste-spark system that uses the PCM to control when the coils fire and the ICM just carries out those actions/commands. dwell is likely controlled via ECM pulse length as well.

Well, I can't find anything in megasquirt that reads long and short pulses that the lx9 reluctor puts out. I did however find lots of information about decoding crank signals and modifying them for the megasquirt to understand which is typically used in coil over plug setups.

I am just trying to figure out if i can use this system to read the two crank signals that the cps puts out and give the megasquirt a signal that's not long/short.


A local friend/mechanic had an idea to get the old distributor that was used on the motors and use the variable reluctor signal that was outputted by them.
Thoughts?

[Jonpro03]

Oh and, what kind of signal is put out by the cam position sensor? I may be able to use that with the megasquirt.

[robertisaar]

i remember someone comparing the 3500 reluctor to the LS1 reluctor actually... i don't remember what came of it though...

[robertisaar]

Oh and, what kind of signal is put out by the cam position sensor? I may be able to use that with the megasquirt.

simple 1X signal. i believe it's a high signal that when the notch passes the sensor, it gets driven low(or is that reversed?). notch should be at TDC cylinder 1 at the exhaust/intake transition.

[Jonpro03]

GREAT!

YES!
http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms2extra/MS2-Extra_LS1.htm

http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms2extra/MS2-Extra_Ignition.htm#ls2

I love it when there's directions!

It will need a little modification in the software but this should get me 90% there!

EDIT: Looks like it's closer to the LS2, which is bad because of this:

LS2 (gen 4) trigger wheel

Unknown whether this works.
Apparently around 2006, a different 58 tooth trigger wheel and a 4 tooth cam wheel were put into the engines. Until we have some timing data on these wheels we don't know whether they will work as-is or whether special code is required.

[Jonpro03]

Robert, do you have the diagram for the harness on the coils for the lx9?

[robertisaar]

this should keep you busy.....

http://imgur.com/H1aHB.png

http://imgur.com/2k30U.png

http://imgur.com/NrCjX.png

[Jonpro03]

this should keep you busy.....

http://imgur.com/H1aHB.png

http://imgur.com/2k30U.png

http://imgur.com/NrCjX.png

Just what I needed, thanks!

I'm really REALLY torn on whether or not to try to make this LS2 setup work with my megasquirt (a lot of work) or to buy an external trigger (a lot of money) and use the DIS the megasquirt is currently setup to run.

Do I wana do lots of work or spend lots of money...

[robertisaar]

lots of work and potential incompatiblity...

or you could... you know.... just run the 1227727 on either 8F or code59 and save a LOT of time and potentially money.