'04 Venture 3.4 into '96 Grand Prix 3.1

[WymanV]

Hi gents-new to the site and new to the project.

I'm in the process of dropping a 2004 Chevy Venture 3.4 (33K miles, $850, can't complain) into my 96 Grand Prix-3.1, 189,026 miles and baked head gasket. I've been referencing 3400swap.com on this and everything is going pretty smoothly so far. However (of course) I have a couple "issues"...

First is with the EGR system. korbendallas68 recommends modifying the old one off the 3.1 by installing a plate, but the thing is the new one has the same plug. Do I still have to use the old unit, or will this one work? I'm in the Republik of California so emissions is an issue.

Second is the O2 sensor. They are both 4 wire sensors and I'd like to use the newer one but 1.-the plug is different and 2. the wire colors are different. The old one is purple, white, brown, brown and the newer one is blue, white, black, black. The wire ends are the same but the plastic housing is different. Since I'm doing this on the cheap, it would be feasable for me to switch the plastic ends if the sensor is compatible, but do the wires coincine-purple=blue, brown=black, etc.?

And another one comes to mind-the crankshaft sensor has the same wire ends on both. Any real need to pull my harmonic balancer to change that?

Thanks for any help you guys can give me with this. I'd love to get this thing running this weekend so I can get it to the exhaust shop Monday. I've been driving the GFs Saturn for almost a month now and it doesn't compare...

Ken

[nixtux]

This is only suggestion, but some of the Haynes manuals have wiring diagrams toward the end. Perhaps that may yield results regarding the wires. Otherwise I'm not sure.

However I'm in the process of doing a similar swap on a 95' Cutlass Supreme so I'd be interested to see/hear the end result.

Hi gents-new to the site and new to the project.

I'm in the process of dropping a 2004 Chevy Venture 3.4 (33K miles, $850, can't complain) into my 96 Grand Prix-3.1, 189,026 miles and baked head gasket. I've been referencing 3400swap.com on this and everything is going pretty smoothly so far. However (of course) I have a couple "issues"...

First is with the EGR system. korbendallas68 recommends modifying the old one off the 3.1 by installing a plate, but the thing is the new one has the same plug. Do I still have to use the old unit, or will this one work? I'm in the Republik of California so emissions is an issue.

Second is the O2 sensor. They are both 4 wire sensors and I'd like to use the newer one but 1.-the plug is different and 2. the wire colors are different. The old one is purple, white, brown, brown and the newer one is blue, white, black, black. The wire ends are the same but the plastic housing is different. Since I'm doing this on the cheap, it would be feasable for me to switch the plastic ends if the sensor is compatible, but do the wires coincine-purple=blue, brown=black, etc.?

And another one comes to mind-the crankshaft sensor has the same wire ends on both. Any real need to pull my harmonic balancer to change that?

Thanks for any help you guys can give me with this. I'd love to get this thing running this weekend so I can get it to the exhaust shop Monday. I've been driving the GFs Saturn for almost a month now and it doesn't compare...

Ken

[3100 MPFI]

Since your car is a 1996 already, the EGR's are the same, just mounted differently. You can use the EGR that came with the engine, and just plug it right in.

You will most likely want to use the O2 sensor that came on your car (not on the engine). I don't know about calibration issues, but if that newer one is not calibrated to the 1996 PCM like the knock sensor is, but if it is, and you don't swap it, then you might have issues down the road.

The crank position sensors should be the same, but I will check for you to be sure.

One more sensor that you will want to change out is the KNOCK SENSOR. You want to use a knock sensor that is the same year and engine as the PCM. If you are using a 1996 3100 PCM, then you want to use a 1996 3100 knock sensor.

If you need any 1996 W-body wiring diagrams, I am doing an OBD2 conversion to my 1988 Cutlass Supreme, so I have the books here.

[3100 MPFI]

K. The crank position sensor under the harmonic balancer is the SAME, so no issues there.

[WymanV]

Excellent. Thanks Taylor!

Got it in there last night and everything but the exhaust done on the bottom. Hope to get the top done today and maybe-just-maybe fire it up.


Ken

[nixtux]

Did you have to remove the ABS pump to get the motor to clear?

I'm about ready to pull my 3100 out of my cutlass, however, I'm not sure if it's going to clear with the pump in? Also I have to extract the transmission since it's toast. Would it be best to pull the motor then the transmission or just do both at the same time? I'm pretty sure the pump will need to be removed for both cause it doesn't appear to have clearance for both with the pump in the way.

I also found a 96' Grand Prix SE /w a bad motor I'm probably going to pick up. Would that provide the parts needed for a complete swap to a 2000+ 3400 (Newer is better I always say.) For example, Computers, Sensors (I get I'll likely want to replace many of them for GP,) but I don't want to get the car if it isn't going to benefit my project.

Sorry I didn't make a new post, however, this seems to follow suite with what I'm doing so I figured give it a shot.

Thanks for any advice in advance.

Excellent. Thanks Taylor!

Got it in there last night and everything but the exhaust done on the bottom. Hope to get the top done today and maybe-just-maybe fire it up.


Ken

[3100 MPFI]

If you pull the engine seperate from the transmission, as long as you remove the exhaust crossover, then it will come out just fine. The ABS does not get in the way (But you hvae to watch out for it, 'cause they are pretty close. I did it to my 1996 Grand Prix without a problem.

If you use the newer engine, you will not have a problem (as long as you swap out the fuel injectors). You do NOT want to use the 2000 PCM at this time. Use the 1996 one. The newer PCM will need to see some SENSORS that your car does not have, and I don't know how to add, for example, the 2000+ PCM needs to see the pressure of the FUEL TANK, but it has the same fuel setup as the older car as far as I can tell. That is one of the reasons that the newer cars gets a CHECK WALLET..... er..... check ENGINE light if the gas cap is left off. I don't know how it will run if you don't hook it up.

The 3100 I pulled out of my 1996 Grand Prix, I had done an LG8 conversion (large port 3100) to it. The only things that I didn't do was the fuel injectors, seeing that they were the thin ones, and the PCM might not be able to run them right). Everything else was pretty much bolt on, and it made the 1996 L82 3100 into basically a full late 1999 LG8 3100 (yes, the large port 3100 came out in 1999. That was the only year that had it so that if you had a 1996-1999 L82 you could do the swap without messing with the EGR. The older LINEAR EGR bolted right up to it with the stock EGR pipe and everything.

[nixtux]

My Cutlass is a 95, Supreme. I figured swap over the computers and do a conversions to OBDII. Just want to make sure that's going to work before I buy the car and drive 120 miles to get it (rent a trailer to tow it using two tanks of gas in the old truck.)

Are you familiar with anyone using an external Fuel Pump on these cars? I wouldn't mind getting a high flow external fuel pump. Make it easier to change and the one I have in there is crap. It's a junk yard special that I got in a pinch when the original went out a year and half ago.

My goal is to get a newer 3400 /w low miles and probably rebuilt a good portion of the motor. I'm debating about doing a turbo application, so my goal is to make the motor work n/a but strong enough to take 4-6psi boost. But I'd like to squeeze as much power out of the 3400 w/o boost. Between 220-250HP would be awesome. With good power across the board.

At this point I just want to get my car back together so I can drive it again with the original 3100 (rebuilt 5 years ago, has about 110,000miles since rebuild 176k total - never taken her over 80MPH,) and use the grand prix as a "parts" car for a future transmission/engine swap in my Cutlass. Then junk the Grand Prix.

I have a huge garage (I can easily fit 5 cars in it,) so I have plenty of room to store any number of parts for a future transplant. Ideally I want to have the motor, transmission, exhaust, computers, wire harness laid out neatly to transplant into my Cutlass in March/April.

What would you recommended for rebuilding a 3400? In respect to upgraded parts? Right now I'm a bit short on cash (business always sucks in Oct-Dec, but Jan is normally my best month) but come months end I'd like to drop a few grand into the parts needed for this project.

should I rebuild from the block up? Or just do the top /w new piston (forged I'd assume since I'd like to do a turbo setup sometime. ) But I want it to be really strong so it can take the punishment. I'm not exactly hard on my vehicles, but I certainly enjoy the feeling of torgue. And I like reliablily.

This will be my first engine rebuild so please excuse any stupid questions. I have a friend who will be helping who is more versed so I'm not going into this super blind. But at this point, kind of/

I hope that makes sense.

If you pull the engine seperate from the transmission, as long as you remove the exhaust crossover, then it will come out just fine. The ABS does not get in the way (But you hvae to watch out for it, 'cause they are pretty close. I did it to my 1996 Grand Prix without a problem.

If you use the newer engine, you will not have a problem (as long as you swap out the fuel injectors). You do NOT want to use the 2000 PCM at this time. Use the 1996 one. The newer PCM will need to see some SENSORS that your car does not have, and I don't know how to add, for example, the 2000+ PCM needs to see the pressure of the FUEL TANK, but it has the same fuel setup as the older car as far as I can tell. That is one of the reasons that the newer cars gets a CHECK WALLET..... er..... check ENGINE light if the gas cap is left off. I don't know how it will run if you don't hook it up.

The 3100 I pulled out of my 1996 Grand Prix, I had done an LG8 conversion (large port 3100) to it. The only things that I didn't do was the fuel injectors, seeing that they were the thin ones, and the PCM might not be able to run them right). Everything else was pretty much bolt on, and it made the 1996 L82 3100 into basically a full late 1999 LG8 3100 (yes, the large port 3100 came out in 1999. That was the only year that had it so that if you had a 1996-1999 L82 you could do the swap without messing with the EGR. The older LINEAR EGR bolted right up to it with the stock EGR pipe and everything.

[3100 MPFI]

yes it does. That is why I keep a complete totalled parts car. I have a project coming up that I will need it. What I intend to do might RUIN a car, so I want to do the swap to my totalled car before I do it to one of my good ones seeing I will be cutting out part of the body.

First of all, the stock 3400 is pretty strong, and for as low as 4-6 PSI of boost, you really should not need to do anything. I would just open it up, and check all of your clearances, and go ahead and put new bearing and stuff in.

For an OBD2 conversion, I would recommend using a 1996 PCM. The newer one, you will have to do a lot more.

Some things you will have to rewire for the 1996 in your 1995 is add in a second O2 sensor (which you can do with a simulator). You will also need to add in a MAF, and the newer EGR. All of that is pretty easy.

[WymanV]

I didn't pull anything off brake or exhaust related. Made things a little tight putting it back together, but with age comes patience I guess-took my time and everything came out fine. Fired it up Sunday afternoon and everything works. Still need to replace a too-short heater hose and I'm having a helluva time finding a replacement header pipe but the motor is solid and strong. And BTW-had to change the oil pan too. The GP has what I'm guessing is a level sensor, the Venture did not.

Thanks for your help, gents

Ken

[3100 MPFI]

I didn't know about the different pans. By header pipe, are you referring to the exhaust downpipe? If that is the case, you can get one from a 1999 LUMINA (car) with the 3100, and it will bolt right up. That is what I am using in my 1988 Cutlass Supreme.

[WymanV]

The pan in the van had the "plugs" for the sensor, but the hole for the sensor itself would have had to be drilled out and the one for the retaining bolt tapped. Much less trouble to just swap the pans

Yup-that's the pipe. I'll still have to go to a junkyard to get one. When I talk to them on the phone, they get confused and just don't want to get involved. This was the beauty of finding the motor too-"A 3.4 to put in a 96 Grand Prix with a 3.1? Can't be done/need to change the computer/no, we don't have one, sorry".

Ken

[nixtux]

This is a complete irrelevant question, however, I'm curious.

I've been looking at some electric air compressors cause I want to update to air ratchets this week (gets old hand turning everything.)

Currently I have a 125psi gas A/C /w 2G tank, which I rarely use except to air up tires or flush the transmission cooler.

Would 150psi be enough /w 15G tank? There is a decent deal for a 150psi /w 15G tank - and set of air ratchets for $200ish. But I also have my eyes on a 20G 200PSI w/o ratchets for 200.

I know with regular ratchets, some just plan SUCK! I've learned that Craftmans seem to be the best. A bit expensive but you don't end up buying one, breaking a few bolts and the damn thing is just clicking on you or not adjusting.

My question regarding Air Ratchets. Should I just front the cash for a set from Sears or would the $50-$75 sets at Wal-Mart be good enough? Just some recommendations regarding compressors/ratchet sets.

Thanks

[3100 MPFI]

I go with craftsman myself. Can't help with the air compressor seeing I don't have one, but as for the tools, I go with craftsman for the warranty.

[pontiacdohc@gmail.com]

As Far As Compressors Go Its Not The Psi U Have To Worry About Its The Cfm Look For One With At Least 5.5 Cfm If You Plan On Running Anything Like And Die Grinder,impact Or Hammer.

ALSO THE WALL MART SHIT, I JUST GOT A SET OF THEM FOR CHRISTMAS THEY SEEM TO BE ALL RIGHT BUT I ALWAYS CHECK BY HAND TO SEE SEE IF STUFF IS TIGHT OR NOT, BUT AS FAR AS BREAKING BOLTS LOOSE THERE GOOD SO FAR!