3400/3500 top end swap on a 2.8

[3100 MPFI]

the gasket is kinda sandwiched.

It is 2 pieces of plastic with a gasket in the middle of it

It could be you got older versions of that gasket. The new ones are not prone to failure like the older ones.

If the silicone is RED, or BLUE, then it is NOT the one that dexcool will eat.

[Tonglebeak]

Well now...I just bought that set. I'll let you guys know about them.

I still need to get bolts for all of this...I have no bolts for anything!

[IsaacHayes]

You'll be ok for a few years or 40-100k. but eventually all the plastic ones will fail. Just keep an eye on the motor every once and a while and you'll be fine. I knew nothing about the gaskets when mine started leaking coolant into the oil, but I knew it shouldn't have mayonnaise on the oil fill cap!

[Tonglebeak]

I just got the gaskets today. I assume the LIM gasket is the one that fits between the heads and LIM correct?

The gasket is black with red plastic linings in it. The plastic feels pretty sturdy though.

Is there anyone specifically I can PM about getting a chip burned? I posted on the ecm forums a while ago but no one ever replied.

[Tonglebeak]

Alright, after reading up about cams, I decided that

http://app.infopia.com/Shop/Control/Product/fp/SFV/32214/vpid/3451670/vpcsid/0/rid/126348

Might be the the best for me. Can my stock ECM support this cam?

[LeftVentricle]

Bumpin dis for update. Also, that link is bad, Tonglebeak.

[Tonglebeak]

Sorry, I hit a deadend for this. I never could decide what cam to use. When I did decide, I contacted several people, but none can burn a chip that'll support a bigger cam, with 3400 injectors, without flow ratings, or even seeing the car.

http://www.engine-parts.com/GMV6/28camspecs.html

Phase 2 cam was what was recommended at one point, but I wanted to use the bigger injectors as well, unless the 2.8 injectors can, without a doubt, keep up with the larger cam...I might be stroking up to 3.1 in the process as well, so I'm not sure if the 2.8s can handle it.

I never got the miscellaneous parts (crappy winter). I do however have all of that parts I got before, still with me (heads, throttle body, plenum, gaskets, lim, exhaust).

Yes I still want to go through with this, and it's looking a lot better now that the weather is getting better. I however need guidance as far as a cam is concerned. If I'm not mistaken, gaskets have to be replaced everytime a part it sits between gets pulled, correct? That's why I want to get teh cam done in one shot with this.

[LeftVentricle]

Yeah, most of the associated gaskets are "crush," or basically ruined once the seal is broken. So you've got the right idea. But I'm thinking you should just skip the cam for now, since it makes tuning simpler, and I'm sure you'll be plenty satisfied with ~170 hp. I know I would be, and I've got that 3.1 Rhett dropped back in which has 15 hp/20 ft-lbs on your engine.

This bump serves a dual purpose, as I've been wondering for some time if anyone has actually completed a 3x00 top end swap on an MFI (LB6, LH0) engine. I know L82s (early 3100) have been done already. If so, I feel that a write-up should be done, including what parts are necessary aside from the obvious heads and intake, and it should be sticky either here or the Pushrod Performance forum. That would reduce the potential number of future threads on this subject that will likely arise, so the knowlegdeable members won't get exasperated by "another damn MFI top end thread."

Pretty please.

[bszopi]

You mean like this? http://www.60degreev6.com/content/Ge..._3_TopEnd_Swap

[3100 MPFI]

yes, it has been done. The only person I can think of right now that has done it is Chris (GPXSS), but I know there is others. In fact, I think I got to drive Chris's that time that Lorenzo and I met up with him in Charlotte. I know I at least rode in the MISSING back seat. That was an interesting day. That was the same time he scanned the chip in my 1988 Cutlass Supreme. I had not modified that engine yet, and it was a 1988 with the functioning MAF sensor.

doing the hybrid, and doing a swap from a 2.8/3.1 is not that different. I did a complete 3100 swap in my 1988 Cutlass Supreme, and it was a LOT more involved than just swapping it out and being done with it. There is cooling system issues, throttle cables, transmission, exhaust, ecm.....

[LeftVentricle]

You mean like this? http://www.60degreev6.com/content/Ge..._3_TopEnd_Swap

...How did I miss that? Thanks.

[Tonglebeak]

I'm sorry for bumping this really old thread that I dumped, but the interest has been renewed since it looks like my 2.8 has a failing gasket.

Just a few things:

a) What is a MAP-Plenum-FPR hose???
b) What exactly are brass compression fittings? THe hybrid guide says I need one 3/8 and one 5/16 for the fuel rail...
c) Am I screwed as far as the 95 3100 beretta cable goes, because I cannot find one anywhere...
d) The coolant sensor...I'm too tired to even think about it, but is it simply a matter of sticking my old one in the place where the new one is on the LIM?
e) The downpipe...will a 3100 downpipe from any car work or do I _have_ to have one from a 3100 Ciera?

I'm sure when I wake up some more I'll ask more questions...thanks.

[Tonglebeak]

I guess a couple more questions...

1) Does the a-body platform need the overflow tank out of a j-body? I don't understand why the guide says we need one...

2) Smith Brothers Push Rods (lengths: INTAKE 5.94 in, EXHAUST 6.275 in) .. are these the correct lengths?

[IsaacHayes]

A) on stock 3100's its a hard plastic vacuum line that goes to those parts.
c) try 94-96 beretta, 94-98 grand am, corisca, etc.
e) depends on where your downpipe comes out at. Some come out at the side, some at the center.

[2.8/3400 1985 Camaro]

Ok so I know the bulk of what I need to for this swap (I'm doing it on 2.8L 1985 Camaro) but have lots of questions about the little things/details and further modifications than the standard swap entails.....
1: DIS conversion?-I've heard that the 3400 upper on my block won't leave room for my 2.8 stock dizzy, I'm not sure if this is true or not but even if it isn't I would like to go to electronic fuel injection, and am not sure if my stock computer can support that, and if it will, I don't know what sensors I'll need to get and how to set them up....
2: EGR valve?-, on the 2.8 its vacuum controlled, and on the 3400 its electronic, I would like to use the 3400 electronic one, is there anyway to do it? Because all the info I've found on the swap says to get an adapter plate and use the stock EGR of the 2.8
3: With the two above in consideration would it be in my interest to get a 3400 ECM, and will that work with my setup?
4: Hydraulic roller cam and lifters?-I've got a big honking cam planned for this.....it is hydraulic roller lifter though, and the standard swap procedure reuses the stock camshaft of the 2.8 motor, which is hydraulic flat tappet, what do I need to do to convert to the 3400 style cam, or is it simply a matter of getting new lifters??
5: ECM tune?- From what I've gathered the stock ECM CAN run the standard swap, but should be tuned sooner than later, so given that I'm doing the hybrid build AND a ginormous cam, will my car even be able to start, and will i damage something if I try to? And if so is there a way to tune it without starting it, or at least get it in the vicinity to prevent risk of damage and just tweak it while its running after that? And can your typical aftermarket performance tuning chip handle this tuning, or do I have to go to a dyno?? I also need to increase the rev limiter and have no idea how to do that....(covered by one of the above I hope?)
6: Compression ratio?- Stock compression ratio for the 2.8 is 8.9:1 and for the 3x00 its 9:5.1, after the hybrid setup if the calculation is correct it will be 14.6:1, which is a pretty large increase, does that warrant any changes not covered in the above? like do I need stiffer valve springs, stronger interals or anything, and will the new cam and valvetrain setup intended to go with it work with that high a CR, the camshaft I plan on getting is here: http://wot-tech.com/shop/all/race-ca.../prod_244.html