Ugh... Trying to use a 00+ EGR on a '97...

[MantaGreen97]

Does anyone make an adapter to do this? I mean to go from the vertical mount EGR to the horizontal one? Or has anyone had success doing this?

I've caught one more hitch I wasn't planning on as I thought it would be doable based on comments from someone else a while back, but I'm really at a loss as to how to make it work.

My car stock, had a vertical mount 96-99 style linear EGR, and I'm trying to use the new horizontal mount 00+ EGR (along with plenum, LIM, heads) on my older L82...

Now I thought it might be possible to just swap the pipe on the exhaust manifold and then maybe use the new pipe and all would be well (?). But the pipe is a LOT harder to get off than it would seem, so I don't think I can got that route. (I wonder if running the manifold up to temperature would make the nut easier to turn?).

Anyway going by comments by a user on a Grand Am forum some time ago, he claimed that he easily hooked up the old EGR pipe to the new EGR doing this:

"The new EGR's are side mounted, while 94-99 was top mounted (yes 99 manifolds differ from 00). Anyways all i did was tighten the old nut where the tube hooks to the manifold on the back of the new egr and that holds the old bracket up tight against there. Perfect."

Although I have no idea how he did that because I tried turning things every which way and nothing lines up. The old bolts are also way too long and only half-threaded so I don't get how this guy did this at all. I PM'd him but the post was 2 years ago and he doesn't even have a Grand Am anymore I don't think.

There's two threaded holes on the old-style plate that connects up to the UIM where the long bolts thread through and connect all of the UIM, EGR and pipe together. On the 00+ EGRs, the EGR bolts to the plenum with two bolts, and then the pipe from the exhaust bolts to the EGR with one bolt.

The only way I can see making the pipe fit the new EGR is if I were to drill a hole in the plate and use a shorter bolt and then secure the EGR to the plate that way. Only a couple problems--the old EGR inlet for the exhaust pipe was slightly smaller meaning the old pipe is "loose" in the new EGR

I was thinking maybe wrapping some muffler tape around the pipe end would make it fit better, would that work? Is muffler tape high enough heat bearing to do that at the EGR?

Also I don't have a drill bit large enough on hand at the moment which makes things worse

The only way I can even imagine what that guy did was if he used a shorter bolt (and not the original one as he said) and basically "clipped" the bolt head such that it just caught the bracket and held it on to the EGR. However this does not seem very secure and again does not solve the pipe diameter problem.

If anyone knows if there is such an adapter made, I would appreciate any info on it. I'm thinking if there is an adapter I can just jerry-rig it like the above for the time being and then get the adapter later...

If there is no adapter I would probably try my method of drilling a hole and using muffler tape on the pipe, but again no drill bit right now Very frustrating! And, I think it would be pretty darn difficult to drill a hole in the plate once I install the head in the car (meaning if I jerry-rigged it, then I'd probably be stuck with it like that).

If anyone has any advice/tips/info on how to make this work, I'd really apprecaiate it!

[IsaacHayes]

I used some PB blaster and a large wrench to take the EGR tube off. I think I ended up tapping the wrench handle with a hammer much like an impact gun and it started to move. Mind you I had only about 1/2" of room to turn the wrench and no leverage to put my arm in there so thats why I tapped with the hammer.

If you wanted to just be done with it a 96-99 UIM from a 3400 would have your style EGR mount and be large port. But the neck isn't as nice flowing as the 2000+ models.

[Guest]

I would do one of two options:

1) get an newer ('00+) UIM and bolt it on.

OR

b) Get an older ('96 to '99) EGR and bolt that on. If your car is newer than 2000 1/2, then you may need to change the plug on the harness.

[IsaacHayes]

Raven, I think you got his setup backwards. He has a 97 and trying to put a 2000+ UIM on.

[Guest]

Well the post is confusing and so I went by the title "Trying to use '00+ EGR on '97".

Horizontle mount = '96 to '99

Vertical mount = '00+

There would be no need to make an adaptor for this since the EGR parts are readily available, that will match whihc ever intake is being used here.

[MantaGreen97]

Well the post is confusing and so I went by the title "Trying to use '00+ EGR on '97".

Horizontle mount = '96 to '99

Vertical mount = '00+

There would be no need to make an adaptor for this since the EGR parts are readily available, that will match whihc ever intake is being used here.

Sorry if that was confusing, but to me it says exactly what I'm trying to do. I'm using an 00+ plenum and an 00+ EGR with it, and I'm trying to get it to work with a 1997 vehicle which has a pipe for the earlier EGR.

Also, I tend to think of it the opposite way, the '99 and prior mount vertically if you ask me (the mount is at the bottom) and the 00+ mount horizontally (since the mount is on the side).

Anyway I did hear back from the guy that put an 00+ plenum on his 96-98 GA... What he did was what I suspected, he used a bolt that pretty much held on the existing EGR pipe plate to the new EGR, by just the edge of the bolt. He said it worked for him with no issues, though I tend to think it would leak because the pipe is actually a bit smaller than the opening on the new EGR. Some Seafoam will be the judge of that I guess--always the best way to find exhaust leaks

I tried drilling through that plate but that plate is pretty thick, relatively strong and so that didn't get me far with a hand drill, lol. So I'm just going to take the same route as the guy above (unless there is an adapter available someplace).

Does anyone know if muffler tape can handle that temperature? If not how about some header/manifold wrap tape? That should work... What I intend to do is just wrap a small piece of that around the pipe and then it would be more snug and make a better seal in the EGR.

[Guest]

Arg....

Some english lessons seem top be in order.....

Your title has no mention of UIM, just "'00+EGR" to be used on a "'97"....
And the body of your post went all over the place, and extremly hard to follow. You may know what you are trying to say, but we can't read your thoughts, this is where slowing down and putting key points and maybe even some back ground info makes it easier for those of us that don't follow each and every other persons build on a daily basis.

Anyways, the "mount description" beitween vertical and horizontle has been commonly accepted to be in refernce to the UIM itself, not the pipe connection to the EGR.

Why do you not want to just use the matching EGR to the plenum or the matching plenum to the EGR, would be SO much easier than trying to modify something to work that really doesn't need to be.

There's no reason to ghetto rig this, when the proper parts are easily found.

[MantaGreen97]

Arg....

Some english lessons seem top be in order.....

Your title has no mention of UIM, just "'00+EGR" to be used on a "'97"....
And the body of your post went all over the place, and extremly hard to follow.

Actually I take offence to this just a little bit. I do appreciate you trying to help me with the EGR, but English is my first and only language; and, I am actually educated, LOL. While in university I used to write a lot of multi-thousand word essays, usually the night before or the day of, usually beating most people in my classes. In fact, where most people usually struggled to get to the word limit I always had to use word processor tricks to make my papers look shorter because I was always way over the limit...

And yeah I graduated cum laude--and I did this sleeping through perhaps 70% of my classes to boot Anyway this may all be irrelevant but I'm just mentioning it because I've actually never had anyone ever tell me my English was bad. So I sort of feel the need to defend myself on that front.

But I do apologise. The reason my first post may have seemed a little cryptic is simply because it was actually longer to start with and then I figured "wow that's pretty long, no one is going to read this" so I cut it down a bit (and it's still really long).

Anyways, the "mount description" beitween vertical and horizontle has been commonly accepted to be in refernce to the UIM itself, not the pipe connection to the EGR.

What's funny is I used to think of it that way before I was posting on here and I swear people referred to it the other way and that's how I changed. Anyway, it doesn't matter we're both talking about the same thing

Why do you not want to just use the matching EGR to the plenum or the matching plenum to the EGR, would be SO much easier than trying to modify something to work that really doesn't need to be.

Well the L82 plenum is pretty low flow compared to the LG8 and LA1 plenums. And my motor is still 3.1L... Get it? :P There are no LG8s that had the older EGR mount. So I'd have to put a 3400 plenum on my car to have the same EGR mount and though it seems maybe too technical (or perhaps even vein), I just don't want my engine to read "3400" when it isn't a 3400. Furthermore, I already got the LG8 UIM ported so I pretty much have to use it.

There's no reason to ghetto rig this, when the proper parts are easily found.

Again, there's no such thing as an LG8 UIM with the older EGR mount. Now perhaps there's the option of switching the pipe... Will the 00+ manifold to EGR pipe work on my car? There's still a problem there of course, because I can't get that pipe off for the life of me... I had the manifold on the ground, propped so it wouldn't move from the reaction to the torque applied and I pretty much jumped on the wrench and it just slipped and started to round the nut instead of turning it. So I'm guessing that's just rusted so as to form one permanent piece, and it's not coming off, LOL.

I could have cut the pipe off and then tried using a socket and breaker bar, but then what if it really was rusted into one part? Then I'd be into a manifold replacement. Of course I could try to loosen it with the exhaust at temperature--perhaps that might work. But of course I still need to know if an 00+ pipe will work on my car, which I haven't really seen confirmation of in doing a search.

Anyway all of that said, I'm pretty sure I'll get by with what I'm planning. If the guy that did it by just "hooking" the bolt on the bracket never had a problem, I doubt I will either.

[IsaacHayes]

Use some PB blaster, torch it some, I'm sure you can get that nut off some how.

Not sure if the 2000+ 3x00 egr tube would fit your manifold but probably. I know a 3500 tube wouldn't because their manifolds are a lot different. I'd have to see a picture of the 2000+ 3x00 tube.

[Guest]

Well, I had a VERY difficult time following what you were trying to say, and just because you use a lot of words doesn't by any means that you can convey what you are trying to explain, and I can usually deceifer some pretty bad english, usually with ease too, your first post was just way too hard to follow with the ideas jumping back and forth from one idea to another. Also the title is as I had already stated, indicating that you were trying to use a newer EGR on an older ??? Vehicle maybe, older engine, it was still pretty vauge. Get offended, I don't give a rats ass, I only mention it due to the fact that if I had a hard time following it, I'm sure many other people would too.

Again, no reason to ghetto rig, just some research and time would show you that you can find an older 3400 UIM that is blank, in fact these are somewhat sought after items, due to the very fact that it is blank, and can be customized more easily than one that has the raised letters. I also have one, that I am toying with using, when or if I swap a 3400 into my '98 Malibu.

There is yet another reason that ghetto rigging is not needed, there are EGRs available that will fit your newer 3100 plenum, imagine that.
Now to get that tube out heat it with a torch and then you will be able to remove it. The connections at the manifolds are the same IIRC. I'm 99% sure there have only been two types of connections used at the manifold end and that was changed in generation, as in the genII has the older "flare nut" style, while the newer (genIII) all use the threaded (outside) nut, the proper names of these types of connections are just not coming to me, it's late, and the description should be good enough. If they look similar they are the same. since I believe all genIII (other than the 3500) used the same connection at the rear exhaust manifold.
Put the manifold in a vice, use some torches, heat the piss out of the manifold (not the tube nut), so that the manifold heats up and expands away from the nut, efectivly loosening it. Then using a wrench, box end if you can fit it over the other end of the tube, loosen the nut, once it's broken loose, let everything cool, and then finish removing the tube then. Sometimes when removing the nut with the manifold still hot can destroy the threads in the manifold.

[SappySE107]

Get offended, I don't give a rats ass

Im banning you for a day. All your warnings got used up when you fucked with me twice. Learn to let it go, especially when its trivial bullshit cause thats petty. We appreciate your help but we will not tolerate your attitude. next time its a week.

[3100 MPFI]

There are no LG8s that had the older EGR mount.

Not true. I have one on my 1996 Grand Prix.

The 1999 3100 SFI upper intake manifold (LG*) came with the stock linear EGR mount.

I don't think I have a good pic of it, so I will get one tomorrow.

For now, and to add to the debate, here is a kinda bad pic.

[IsaacHayes]

Hmm so was it 99 that the 3100 went to big ports?

[SappySE107]

2000 was the start as far as I was aware. I have never seen a 3100 large port with the 96-99 EGR. I thought you could just use the 00 EGR with the 97 plug.

[3100 MPFI]

Late 1999 was when they went to the large port. That was the year of the Malibu that my engine came out of.

I will take a pic this afternoon and post it. It has the SAME EGR mount that the stock 1996 EGR had, but it is the large port.

Pics will be posted this evening.

I did not have to modify anything on the EGR for my 1996 Grand Prix when I swapped in the large port intake.