Advice - Economical fuel delivery for Turbo

[Schmieder]

Don't avoid PCM0 (DHP) tuning. That is one area you will want to spend most in.

You are making this fuel delivery issue too complicated. Tuning for the 28's will result in more proper fuel and no hacking at the fuel lines or twisting knobs or smashing bricks and shaking magical eight balls will be required.

lol, I understand. Just trying to get by on a budget until I can drop in MS.

I'm hoping MS is fully programmable. I want to try rigging o2 bungs for each cylinder. Then tuning each cylinder one-by-one for a fine detail tune. Instead of tuning from a mix of all 6 together. May not yeild much if anything but it would be fun to try.

Imagine running the ECU with independent wideband per cylinder. Each cylinder could adjust there personal injector rates independently for a greater tune. But that is just an idea. Probably won't do anything like that unless I run into a lot of $$$ and a lot of free time.

[1988GTU]

I don't understand why you are making it harder than it's really is. OBD2 can do everything MS can do and with the right PCM and tuner, it can be better.

Imagine a stock looking engine harness and everything on your stock gauge cluster working like it should.

[Schmieder]

I don't understand why you are making it harder than it's really is. OBD2 can do everything MS can do and with the right PCM and tuner, it can be better.

Imagine a stock looking engine harness and everything on your stock gauge cluster working like it should.

I know your right, please keep in mind I am learning here. Aside from having welding skills and a solid mechanical edge, there are many things I need to learn.

If I can find a DHP Tuner, that would be best. But I do want to mess with MS just because I love full control. I want the ability to have ECU control of boost control, program to use a wideband, ect.

Maybe I'll just go w/ the DHP when I can find one and latter still do the MS.

Now if someone can confirm what Walbro 255LHP pump will work in my car, I should have mostly what i need to know for now. I looked every where and all Walbro dealers quote for 97+. I can't find a single walbro designed for a 96 grand prix. Now, it may be the exact type of pump i need but I'm not sure and don't want to buy something that won't work.

Can anyone please tell me if a Walbro 255 LHP for a 1997 Grand Prix will work on my 96? And if not, what vehicle or Walbro pump type will work?


Thansk so much for having the patience to deal with my over inquisitive mind.

[RedZMonte]

http://www.autoperformanceengineering.com/html/fpapps.html#gm_apps

i got the High pressure 255LHP for '85-92


Do some searching... you can find DHP used... clubgp, Grand am forums, basicly anywhere that it is supported (GM V6's)... or pwrtuner.com is the forum iirc. thats how i found mine... if you find one get it as quick as you can... they go fast!

[Schmieder]

http://www.autoperformanceengineerin...s.html#gm_apps

i got the High pressure 255LHP for '85-92


Do some searching... you can find them used... clubgp, Grand am forums, basicly anywhere that it is supported (GM V6's)... or pwrtuner.com is the forum iirc. thats how i found mine... if you find one get it as quick as you can... they go fast!

Thanks man!

When the time comes to purchase, I sure will look for the deal. But I am prepared to buy the pump new since this method of fuel management is cheaper then AN-6 fittings, Steel Line, Fuel Rail AN6 Fittings, AFPR, ect.

[Schmieder]

How about those nifty gauges?

I am def getting a boost/vacuum gauge.

But since I will not be adjusting fuel pressure initially, I really don't need a wideband and fuel pressure gauge in the 'cockpit'. But I guess all as well should just mount my digital wideband anyways. I have it, why not!

I was thinking Boost/Vacuum, Oil Press, Oil Temp, Exhaust Temp, Wideband and Transmission temp.

Oil psi/temp and exh temp running up the drivers blind spot and boost/vac mounted just behind the steering wheel and tranny, wideband on center consol. That would look so bad***!

I built my own security system. I bypassed my VATS by wiring a series of resistors under the dash. They are crimped to a simple plug and boxed. I can pull the box and hook it to my keychain if I so desire to. Unless they have a series of resistors and get lucky with the right resistance, that car ain't going NO WHERE, lol. It all started when the hammers in the key rig broke. I freakin hate VATS!

I would think the tranny temp would be important since i am running stock trans 4T60-e. Don't want to burn her out. Would any one seriously recommend an aftermarket tranny cooler or is that for more serious apps above mine?

Exhaust temp is cool. But I can see the use of knowing if my turbo and manifold are glowing or not...lol

Am I missing any important gauges? obviously water temp is stock and the sensor was just replaced a month ago.

[Weatheralls Auto]

WideBand a must!

[Weatheralls Auto]

http://www.aeroforcetech.com/products_interceptor.html

Expensive but very nice as well.

[Schmieder]

http://www.aeroforcetech.com/products_interceptor.html

Expensive but very nice as well.

Oh man, that is it right there!

Yeah, pricey. Maybe down the road I'll save up for a set of 4 or 5. It would be REALLY nice to view ALL those parameters listed.

[Schmieder]

Question regarding the 12:1 FMU.

First off, isn't stock fuel pressure 42.5psi? And if I run 5psi boost with a 12:1 FMU, wouldn't that add 60psi to the 42.5psi? Making the fuel pressure at the rail a whopping 102.5psi!!! Isn't that a tad bit too high?

What about a 10:1 FMU? This way I'm seeing 92.5 psi at full 5psi boost?

Or am I wrong in my math somewhere?

Also, when I go turbo, Is it better to go slightly rich or slightly lean from stock? I would guess slightly rich at idle to help control temps after a boost run. And it may help keep the engine from running lean at 5psi?

[RedZMonte]

You can get a Vortec FMU disc kit (i might still have mine) wich has all the different ratio discs in it so you can swap'em to whatever you want.. I ran a 12:1 on mine and all my honda buddies all ran 12:1 on theirs... it is high but didnt have a problem with mine.. this is why i recommend the "Walbro 255lph HIGH Pressure" pump... as the pressure increases it will hold the fuel pressure up as well.. walbro has a write up on it..

Im running a "AEM WB02" on mine.. fits in a pod mount like the boost gauge.. I have other then my stock gauges a 2 piller pod mount w/ Vac/Boost and AEM WB02. get the basics before you start buying all kinds of gauges.. EGT and water tem and trans temp or oil temp/pressure all that is great if your building a race car or doing massive ammount of tuning... but on a street car your OE gauges will suffice. Save your money for other parts of the install... Tuning, Injectors, qualitly parts, Intercoler, trans cooler, ect...

Get like a B&M Super cooler trans cooler one of the best from what i remember. its universal fit and easy to install and about 2x larger then the OEM cooler. thats what i have on mine, i now have 150,000 hard miles and no trans issues. I also do regular trans services (fluid and filter) ever 30K miles.

S

[Schmieder]

You can get a Vortec FMU disc kit (i might still have mine) wich has all the different ratio discs in it so you can swap'em to whatever you want.. I ran a 12:1 on mine and all my honda buddies all ran 12:1 on theirs... it is high but didnt have a problem with mine.. this is why i recommend the "Walbro 255lph HIGH Pressure" pump... as the pressure increases it will hold the fuel pressure up as well.. walbro has a write up on it..

Sounds like a good idea, thanks. The ability to swap 12:1 to 10, 8, 6 would be nice.

Im running a "AEM WB02" on mine.. fits in a pod mount like the boost gauge.. I have other then my stock gauges a 2 piller pod mount w/ Vac/Boost and AEM WB02. get the basics before you start buying all kinds of gauges.. EGT and water tem and trans temp or oil temp/pressure all that is great if your building a race car or doing massive ammount of tuning... but on a street car your OE gauges will suffice. Save your money for other parts of the install... Tuning, Injectors, qualitly parts, Intercoler, trans cooler, ect...

So the basics would be wideband O2, boost/vacuum? I definately want wideband in the cockpit. I just would not feel right w/o it. Besides, i already have a glowshift wideband gauge, controller and wb O2 sensor. I know they aren't the best but should work just as well good enough.

As far as fuel pressure, I figured I'll just get on to the Schrader Valve and tape it to the dash for FMU configuring. Once all is set up, I don't think I'll need it much.

How about a tranny temp gauge? Since I'll have stock trans. or will I be fine just as long as I don't WOT 0-90mph 3x's a minute and/or drop in a tranny cooler?

Get like a B&M Super cooler trans cooler one of the best from what i remember. its universal fit and easy to install and about 2x larger then the OEM cooler. thats what i have on mine, i now have 150,000 hard miles and no trans issues. I also do regular trans services (fluid and filter) ever 30K miles.

S

So the only killer to a tranny is heat? Aside from extreme torque which I doubt I'll surpass with only 5psi boost. I think I read the stock 4T60-e is good up to 280 lb/ft.

The tranny cooler definately sounds like a good idea. I had thought about that. I also considered an oil cooler just before the turbo feed. Might help increase turbo's lifespan and keep it several degrees cooler I'de imagine.

[Schmieder]

Get like a B&M Super cooler trans cooler one of the best from what i remember. its universal fit and easy to install and about 2x larger then the OEM cooler. thats what i have on mine, i now have 150,000 hard miles and no trans issues. I also do regular trans services (fluid and filter) ever 30K miles.

S

Yeah, those tranny coolers are nice for the price and fittings.

If I were to monitor the health of my oil system, what would be a better option, Temperature or Pressure?

I would think pressure but then again, temp may indicate issues quicker? But that is only IF I choose that route as I can get either gauge for around $20. I just may get both if my budget works well enough. I plan a max of $4,000 and I'm sitting around $3.5K including other general repairs like radiator upgrade, DIY paint job, weld up 2.5" exhaust, high flow cat, stainless tips (cheap)...ect.

Now, I have Superflow 40's but I heard the Turbo does a great job at muffling the sound. Is it reasonable sounding with no resonator and no mufflers? Just Cat and Turbo. I might just drop the Flowmasters in for the sound/tone.

[RedZMonte]

the turbo does quiet it a tiny bit.. bigger turbos don't really suppress much sound.. im runing:
2.25" x-over
T4 Turbo
2.5" Crush bent downpipe (for now)
2.5" mandrel bent catback (no cat)
20" long Magnaflow 4" round muffler
Yed into dual borla Mufflers

its just about how i like it.. throaty but not to loud. i added the resonator to quiet it a little bit, it was a little loud w/o the 4" round res/muffler. I would run your mufflers 1st and see how you like it.

Yes, definatly run a trans cooler if you don't have one. WBO2, Vac/Boost if you want anything else i would say Oil temp is more important or EGT... if you look at the vettes one of the things you can monitor is oil temp. your oil pressure is set by the pump unless there is something wrong with the pump your pressure isnt going to change.

S

[d.o.h.c]

Little thing to remember about the FMU. What ever ratio you go with make sure you have a wideband on your car and a Fuel PSI gauge. Here is what happened to me. I was running 42.5# injectors, Walbro pump and 7psi with a 12.1 FMU. Whats 7 x12?....84PSI!!!!!!!!! plus the normal psi. I was hitting 100+ psi on my rail with the FMU. It was giving me terrible wash down on the cylinder walls.

Some have had better luck with the FMU, but now me lol. Thank god for Shane and his DHP tuner.

Mark