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**brian89gp** · 01-29-2004, 05:23 PM

It has a upgraded compressor wheel, I used to have the measurements. Next time I have the housing off I'll measure it, I remember it was one of the larger T4 ones.

I did contemplate getting it clipped but where would that leave me? I still would have a CT26 that is at its limits.

And yea, a year and a half ago when I bought it I really didn't know what I was doing nor could I afford a Garrett unit, I know better now.

**Guest** · 01-29-2004, 08:40 PM

Where would it leave you? Lets just say the upgraded compressor wheel and the clipped exh will support 400 wheel hp in a 3.0 liter Supra motor from a mk3.

Thats where it will get you. Those guys make that all the time.

Getting measurements on teh comp wheel won't tell me much. I am sure if I sat down and looked online I could find which wheel you have, but its easier if I just knew what trim wheel it was. Cause not all trims are as efficient as the next. The 62-1 or event he 60-1 wheel would be an awesome upgrade for the 3.4 Its very efficient.

GEt a clip, you will be much happier I guarantee it. Also what size is your downpipe and how much boost you running??

**brian89gp** · 01-29-2004, 10:41 PM

2.5" downpipe and in the cold weather it is creaping towards 4-5psi. With that boost it falls on its face around 4k, higher when its warmer out.

I have no doubt that the CT26 can be made to do that, but why? I have read all the same websites telling the potential of the CT26 down to having a Garret center section and huge wheels installed. A lot of the same places suggest going to a Garrett T4 or similar unit instead of the wild CT26 modifications, and the T4 or the T series is always the next step up.

I am looking at $500 to get the turbine clipped and compressor wheel installed, or around $500 to get a brand spanking new T40B 60-1 HiFi with a still undecided turbine. Re-doing the exhaust is no big deal for me.

I do appreciate the help though, I just don't see why I should stick with a turbo that is too small unless modified when a turbo with an UNCLIPPED turbine will cost about the same.

**RacerX11** · 01-29-2004, 10:47 PM

Getting it clipped may help ultimate flow, but it drastically reduces the efficiency of the turbine.

Marty

**Guest** · 01-29-2004, 11:40 PM

Whoa whoa! I have never ever seen a To4b 60-1 hi-fi for even close to $500! Those turbos are actually close to $800-$1000 new. Check out Garrets website and pricing info. YOu might find one on Ebay but I have been looking for some time now and no luck.

Also yoru downpipe is too small. It needs to be AT LEAST 3 inches. 2.5 is too small and will restrict flow in that 3.4

Also 4-5 pounds of boost isn't much. Yes you are probably trying to get it tuned but with that much boost its prob not in the efficiency range of that compressor. Also it might not be the exh wheel that makes it start to feel sluggish or whatnot up top. Could be your tuning?? Not saying it isn't possible but its something to look into. Or comp surge??

You already said you had a compressor wheel upgrade so now all you need is a exh clip. That will be nowhere near $450. The compressor wheel and rebuild is what you are charged for. You dont' need that since you have a larger compressor already installed.

Yea a clip might lower the efficiency of the exh side but look how much flow will be gained up top? Hp gain up top will be more then worth it.

I am not trying to talk you out of a new turbo. If I had known you were going to put the CT 26 on in the first place i would have talked you out of it or at least tried to. Its just that its already in and plumbed and working, to go to a different turbo all new stuff would have to be fabbed and the 60-1 is a big mama jamma as far as compressor size compared to the ct26. So I am also trying to take into account just how much room you have in your engine bay as a T4 might be too big. If you have plenty of room all over then go for it. If its tight it will be even tighter with a T4 if it even fits.

The To4b 60-1 Hi-fi would be a good choice. Pending on how much boost you want to run in the end should determine how big of a turbine a/r you want. If you want lots of boost and big top end power go larger(.80 up) If you want low boost settings under 10 psi go with a .63 or thereabouts exh a/r.

I am guessing you dont' know what comp wheel was used. Bought it used I am guessing? Still able to contact the previous owner? if so I would ask.

Just trying to give you different options to think about is all.

**brian89gp** · 01-30-2004, 12:44 AM

Got it of ebay for cheap, asked the previous owner and he swore the compressor was stock though it is obviously quite a bit larger.

I havn't ruled out a big CT26, if the T4 ends up costing more or I find a upgraded CT26 cheap then I'm all for it. I just have trouble putting even more money into a turbo that as you said is really too small.

2.5" isn't that bad is it. It is small, but I wouldn't consider it being too small.

I know of 2 T04E "60"'s in a w-body, they are big but they do fit

My tuning.... Now that is a whole can of worms. It is off but in general WOT is tuned decently.

**Guest** · 01-30-2004, 01:41 AM

Obviously larger? I am guessing you have a second CT26 laying there to compare it to???

2.5 inch is small. Just for comparison the Mk4 supra guys upgrade to a 3.0 inch downpipe and they are only 3 liters.

Also for comparison, my buddy has a 3 inch DP on his 03 neon SRT-4 and thats I want to say 2.4 liters.

i believe upgraded DP for wrx's are 3 inches and they are what 2.0 liters? See where I am going??

However those cars usually run more boost then 5 psi. If you plan to turn up the wic then I would go larger on the DP. If not then thats a good size.

www.supraforums.com for a upgraded CT 26. Look in the For sale section and go to the MKIII section of the for sale section, there will be a link at the top for that. I usually see upgraded ones go for $400 or so. Sometimes less pending mileage. if you find a nice upgraded one you can always turn around and sell yours as well to help offset the cost.

What are you using to tune? Aftermarket? Modified stocker? Turbo 3.1 chip? What are you using to datalog? To check your a/f ratios?

Just cruious, have any pics of your install? I wouldnt' mind seeing how its all setup. Thanks

**brian89gp** · 01-30-2004, 02:02 AM

I do and true, 3" is best but 2.5" is not too small yet. Remember I have very limited space and honestly am not sure how to wedge a 3" pipe in there. A lot of the 3" downpipe is probably to help with spooling.

For the chip I modified the DOHC chip to do boost. Its done in a similar manner as the TGP chip minus the wastegate stuff. I use EFI Live V4 for logging to log just about anything I want.

www.brian89gp.com , plenty of pics there.

I had seperated the center section from the exhaust housing, leaving the exhaust on the car. I put a plate over the hole where the bearing section should go and left the intake hooked up through all the IC piping. I think I did this because of problems I was having with the bearings and I needed my car to be driveable. What I'm getting to is that during this time the engine revved so much free'er, not like the corked up feeling of with the turbo on it. Since I left the IC piping intact then, and now I got boost when I feel the sluggish revving, it is right to assume that its not an intake problem and not a tuning problem, no? The second I took the turbine wheel out of the exhaust housing things got better, that is what I am basing my conclusions off of.

Someone gave me a phone number of the cheap T4 place, until I get around to calling them I'm not ruling either choice out.

**brian89gp** · 01-30-2004, 03:59 PM

Ran across a good Supra site for once, figured out what I want. I also called that cheap turbo place, $600 for a 60-1 with the 4" inlet, they don't carry the HiFi version.

T04B 60-1 HiFi, on center P-trim turbine with either .58 or .70 A/R housing. Wucha think?

**Guest** · 01-30-2004, 08:52 PM

It depends on what amount of boost you are going to run. If going over 12 pounds then I would go with the .70 If you are going to keep boost under 10 psi get the .58. With that little boost the smaller a/r wont' effect top end and its bigger then your ct26 so no worries there.

SO you took the compressor section off the turbo and then still drove the car but you had the air still being pulled through the intake pipes? DO you run an intercooler??

I would ccheck to make sure you dont' have a plugged up intercooler if you do have one as that will cause a sluggish feeling. if its all blocked up air cant' get through it. Or check yoru intake tubes from the compressor side to the TB. Make sure those aren't clogged.

If you have a intercooler I would measure pressure drop across the core and see how much you are losing. This could be a cause of the sluggishness you feel if the intercooler is just too restrictive or clogged.

And as far as i know the hi-fi is just a different compressor housing and perhaps even backplate. Its a housing with a smaller inlet and outlet for engines that dont' require 4 inch tubing. You could get the regualr 60-1 and use some silicone reducers. Always an option

**brian89gp** · 01-30-2004, 09:16 PM

Yes, I run an intercooler and that is how I ran it that one time. The pipes are clean and the IC is a Saab 900 Blackstone and it is not plugged.

Oh, also at another time I just put a filter on the TB and left the turbo in the exhaust. It still ran like it was plugged up. See what I have been trying to get across?... With the turbine in the housing it won't rev, with the turbine not in the housing it will rev.

I KNOW the turbine is too small and causing at least a good part of the problem, you yourself admitted it that it was too small without a clip. The only original point to this whole thread was to warn others what we both agree on, the stock CT26 is too small.

Got $550? I found a Mustang owner with 2 new 60-1 HiFi's, P trim .81 AR, $1100 shipped.

**Guest** · 01-30-2004, 11:23 PM

Yes you are correct about us both agreeing it is too small without a clip and probably even so with a clip of 10 degrees or less.

See if you can squeeze him down to $1k and I might be game.

Error Page | eBay

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2456761182&category=33742

Saw that but prob not interested but for others maybe that are tracking this thread. Has an 18 degree clip and a 60-1 comp wheel.

**nocutt** · 02-04-2004, 07:37 PM

Very nice work indeed...
Anywayz having work with Chris West of WCF I will tell you, the 60-1 is very viable turbo but if you aren't going to push the envelope with boost I will stick to a smaller unit...
A .58 AR on the hotside is not even worth your time...you are looking for .63 to even start with and 'perhaps' a .76 if you are stick..'perhaps' been the operable word here...
The Quad motor has several advantages, the heads, the cams...the whole valvetrain will work to your advantage...the problem is getting too big of a turbo will get really annoying on the street. where I think it matters most...For example, Chris was using a modified Gn turbo... .63 AR hot side and .60 on the cold side, this thing would lag till about 3K after that, it NEVER falls off...he was running about 7-8psi back then, I don't know what he runs now (after the NEW werks). I think this is good because the motor redlines @ 7k RPMs...A gn turbo can be modified to accept a very big compressor or turbine for that matter: for about half the price of a used 60-1...the cool thing is that the stock appearing housing keeps the streetability intact...
If you are looking for big numbers vs realistic usable numbers then disregard my opinion...

**brian89gp** · 02-04-2004, 11:02 PM

Yea, its a big mess. I am still contemplating another turbo just due to the fact that the 60-1 cost as much as a T series turbo (which btw, for big numbers a T61 looks pretty good too)

I've been looking at T3/T4 hybrids due to the huge price difference, think is I can't find any reference for the T3 turbine to anything to help me select one. Happen to know the specs on a GN turbo?

I'm going to be building a motor to go along with this, lets just say 12+psi.

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