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  • Gas prices.....LONG

    I've been thinking about this for the past couple of weeks ever since we heard that gas prices were going to go up big time this summer. But why are gas prices going up? So many people have opinions on the matter, but it comes back to something so very simple: Supply and demand.

    The hard numbers from every source I have looked at show that there is no shortage of crude coming into the U.S. The problem is we haven't built a new refinery in over 20 years. Ever refinery we have is running at 100% all the time just to fall behind. Of course, the government is in no rush to build a new one, or you think they would have mentoned it by now.

    So prices should go up to around $2.50 this summer. And as much as I hate to say it becuase I need to run 93 in my Grand Prix, the prices need to go that high, and perhaps even higher. Because the one thing that needs to change in this country is all these yuppie suburbanites with their 3 ton sport-utes and turbo diesel pickups who own them for nothing more than a status symbol or a child transport need to take these vehicles back to the dealer and find something that gets more than 16 miles per gallon.

    If you want to find the main cause for the high price of gas, it's these ridiculous trucks and SUVs. And the manufacturers don't help things either when they flaunt that they can build them taller, with more powerful engines, and more towing capacity than anyone will know what to do with. But it is not the manufacturers' fault their vehicles are so popular. It is our fault, because in the end we're the ones that buy them. Now of course there are people out there who use these vehicles for their intended purposes, and that's fine. If you take your sport ute off road, good. That's what it was meant for. If you are towing a concrete trailer with your Chevy 2500HD, fine. It was made to tow. If you have a Surburan or Excursion and use it as a family conveyance, you need to seriously rethink your purchase.

    And even more than that, people in this country seem to have a complex. The size of the vehicle is directly proportional to how fast they drive it. If I'm driving my Lumina down the highway 70 miles an hour to get decent highway mileage, why then do people in sport-utes (mainly) find the need to go 80, 90 or more miles per hour. You're already driving a vehicle that gets poor mileage under normal driving conditions, and now you're vastly exceeding the speed limit and getting far worse mileage. And forget whether you can afford to put gas in it or not. We're past that point in this country. We have to start thinking about whether it's right to be so wasteful of the resources we have.

    So many other countries have it right on the nose when they say we're a wasteful people. In Europe they have a Ford Focus with a VVTi turbo diesel engine that gets 54mpg. Here we have the Focus RS 8, a 450hp compact car! Sure it's a cool idea, but it's just one more example of while others think first of efficiency, we think of big power numbers. So I hope the gas price does go up this summer, and hopefully it will get close to $3 a gallon, if nothing else then to help reverse a swing in consumer vehicle purchases that started way back in the early nineties, because most can't afford the vehicle and the gas at that price. If we want to save money, then we have to start saving energy. There is no miracle on the horizon that is going to bring gas prices into a freefall. They are going to stay high and keep rising until the demand goes back down.

    I know many of us don't own big vehicles, so this doesn't really apply to us. But all of know someone that does. Even my family has owned an Explorer and an Expedition, when before we had those we had two minivans that performed all the same duties quite well. I guess the point is if you do own a truck or sport ute, evalute how you use it and if you could do everything you do with it with something more fuel efficient. And if you know someone who owns one, ask them if they actually use it for what it was intended for. Any part we can play in helping this country become more responsible with energy is a good thing.
    I may own a GTO now, but I'm still a 60V6er at heart.

  • #2
    RE: Gas prices.....LONG

    bravo, that is one hell of a libertarian viewpoint, i compleetly agree with your thinking

    im looking at getting a motorcycle just because of the fuel economy. the camaro gets about 30 MPG nowadays however i can get a cheap ass honda bike brand new for 3 grand that gets 50 MPG
    3.4L camaro some goodies

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    • #3
      America's cars... Damndam things. You think after almost a hundered years of having cars, we would get better results that 12 - 16 mpg. I wish my car got better mpg. 40 mpg should be the mininium for almost car, and if not, you pay a fee, like a gasguzzler fee.

      I'm very much against things that are high-poluters and people who don't care if the hurt the eviroment. It's wrong.
      1995 Grand Am GT
      3400 V6 / 4T60-E / Engine Swap
      3400 Engine Swap Guide Version 2.5 is Available!
      www.3400swap.com

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      • #4
        Even if I had an economy car I would still want it to be fast.

        If I had a Mercades SMART car I would be out there looking for power programmers and larger injectors to make that diesel scream. LOL

        But I have to agree wih the SUV/Truck thing. People do no need what they buy.
        1993 EXT. CAB, 3.4L V6 TBI, 5spd manual. Sonoma
        1990 4Door, 3.2L V6 TBI, 5spd manual. 4X4. Trooper
        Because... I am, CANADIAN

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        • #5
          We have a new tax here in quebec, if your engine is over 4.0L, you'll pay more for plating it only if it's a 95 or newer. That "might" make someone think twice about a 5.7L SUV, then again maybe not.

          I guess I'm not the only that gets pissed off when a huge H2 drives by with 40" wheels (not tires, just big ass wheels with low-profile tires lol). I'll be an awe when I see a Cherokee with 44" super swampers and nothing but mud except for the windshield.
          1991 Corsica 3.1L, 3 speed 100% stock.
          1989 Mustang 5.0, 5 speed not so 100% stock.
          I am Canadian eh? Quebec Canadian too...

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          • #6
            Well, put old man. This conversation came up in my Millwright class today. Here is a quote from a guy in my class. "Well, I work in the oil and gas industry. So, I'm gonna show my support and I'm gonna go out and buy a gas guzzling SUV." Holy redneck, That was brutal. Who thinks like that? Like as if he's getting subsidized buy the oil company's for the extra gas he burns. He might as well save his money and buy a cheaper car. But for every liter he pumps into his car, he can pump one on the ground.

            I hate people like that, It's like de-evolution in way. Just think that guy has kids, and he's teaching them this shit.

            You guys ever watch the movie "Back to the Future 2"? Here's the deal, the movie takes place in 1985. They jump ahead 30 years to 2015. They had flying cars, hover boards, to the second weather, etc. Hey 2015 is comming up quick, and we aren't even close to any of that stuff. Back when the movie came out, their depiction didn't seen that far fetched. But now, with people like that guy in this world, it's a wonder that we aren't all dead. Fucking, narrow-minded, red necks.

            Lyle

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            • #7
              Talk about cars getting worse...

              How about us? I hate to be around if we stay the way are! Eek!! Can you imagine that wieghing 300 - 450 lbs would be normal?!? Yuck.

              We're all evolving into fat-lazy bastards!
              1995 Grand Am GT
              3400 V6 / 4T60-E / Engine Swap
              3400 Engine Swap Guide Version 2.5 is Available!
              www.3400swap.com

              Comment


              • #8
                NO SHIT. A friend of mine is a truck driver for a company here in Edmonton. He was team driving for a week with this one guy who was 450 lbs. One time, he, another guy and my friend Chris went out for lunch. They decided to go to KFC (Kentucky Fried Chicken). Chris said he ordered a 20 peice bucket of chicken, family size fires, family size gravy and 32 oz Pepsi. The mother fucker finished all but 2 peices of chicken!!! And the only reason he didn't eat those 2 peices. Was because he was polite enough to offer Chris and the other guy each a peice.

                Now that is fucking sick. That is like enough calories for an average guy to consume in a week. Never mind a fat lazy slob.

                Lyle

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                • #9
                  GROSS!!! i couldnt eat that in a week!

                  personaly i dont even like big vehicals. big motors are ok. my ls1 Trans/Am gets 30mpg on the highway and 22 in the city, so i'm not too upset about gas yet, it does better than my cavi does. the ls1 is being all kinds of gay right now, it definatly hates the cold weather. every mil is on. and sometimes the guages dont work. its 1 '99, and just rolled 75K last week, so i'm geting sorta pissed. I have a feeling its because gm saved a whole 35 cents on my car by not putting seals in the exterior connectors. I wouldnt mind a smal suv or truck, maybe a tracker (go ahead make fun of me) or an isuzu pickup, i like the sound of "Mighty Max" that mistu had. small enough motor you can boost it cheaply for fun, and you dont have to be boosted all the time. turn it down to save on gas.
                  If you aren't friends with a liar, you aren't friends with anyone.

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                  • #10
                    my .02. it isn't the manufactrer's fault they build what we want or what they think we want. case and point to boost sales of pickups toyota puts v8's in them and pretty much the only reason that v8 is in there is a marketing tactic. I think the reason the gas is up is the U.S. government. ever notice the correlation between bad economic trends and rises in gas prices? the dollar is so weak, i wouldn't be surprised if the canadian monetary unit will end up being worth more(no offense). remember reading about the gas prices in the depression.

                    the point i am making is the government is constantly spending more than it has, imports more than it exports(of course that is as much the citizens fault if not more so), the iraq occupation and there isn't any significant rise in interest rates or taxes so the money has to come from somewhere. gas prices, stiffer fines and such from the judiciary system, little portales like that, perhaps the government will sue the tobacco companies for few more billion.

                    as far as the growing waistbands are concerned more government bullshit and lack of restrictions on corporations. You might have a bill of rights but not in the work force. companies can do what they please to employees and if you refuse you're out. i am pretty sure it is just a matter of time where they will start firing people b/c they are too fat or in too bad of health(well, actually there is a company in VA i think that fired employees b/c they smoked cigarettes) and they don't want to pay insurance. there should be a corporate bill of rights towards employees and corporate conduct. farmers go broke if they grow anything but corn, the corn subsidy is over 10x what it should be. the corn is processed for corn syrup which is in almost 100% of the food that is bad for you. corn syrup is like a super high concentrate of sugar. more than your body could ever burn and unburned fuel turns into fat. ever notice that food that is good for you is almost twice as high as the food that isn't. after corn syrup there is sodium which preserves food longer but there is no limit imposed on the amount in foods. sodium causes to human body to retain fluids, hence gain weight.

                    ok i will shut up now.
                    The Official Rotating Mass Nazi

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                    • #11
                      Ahhh. Im glad to live in a free country where I can talk freely and have the option to own whatever I please, such as a suv or an H2 or a Focus. I think the real issue here is like metioned above. Its supply and demand. If you can afford to own an Expedition or H2 great. Its your life. Do it and have a fucking ball. Just dont go bitching when supply and demand drives gas prices up and you cant make that 900 buck payment. Personally Id like to see prices stabilize somewhere instead of the spikes we get now. Ive seen the the price rise 30 cents over night. That means if you purchased 20 gallons you paid 6 bucks more which in some cases could mean eating a big mac or not. Or buying that go fast part or that computer part, etc. Oh yeah $2.09 in Carbondale tonight yuk.
                      2004 Grand Am GT 3400 ... I had the right to remain silent, I just didn't have the ability.(Ron White)

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                      • #12
                        Gas Prices

                        Hi, I would like to offer a differing opinion, with the hope that it will cause some deep thinking to occur within the readers' brains.
                        Gasoline is 'going up", in that it costs a little more than it did a short time ago. When one considers the effects of inflation (the slow, near- continuous reduction in the value of the standard unit of money we use)
                        and the increase in the amount of direct (and indirect) tax in the price, gasoline has never been such a bargain.
                        Allowing for the effects of inflation (one dollar is not worth as much as it used to be), that gas which cost 35 cents per gallon in the late 1960s would be about $2.00 per gallon today, NOT INCLUDING the increased tax per gallon (it's about 38 cents per gallon where I live). Also, again considering inflation, the gas I bought for $1.00 per gallon in the early 1980s would cost MORE THAN $2.00 per gallon today.
                        Now, when one considers the HUGE INCREASE in environmental protections which refineries have in place today (and the huge additional cost cost), we see that gasoline is provided to today's motorist more efficiently than ever before.
                        Also, consider: since 1973, America has reduced by HALF the amount of energy consumed per unit of output.
                        I hope you will try to prove me wrong, and thereby learn to THINK FOR YOURSELF; don't just accept the conventional wisdom or what 'everybody" is saying, nor what seems right or intuitive to you. The magic word here is THINK.
                        Sign me, "Not Walking"

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                        • #13
                          Here ALL ELECTRIC and as fast as an Enzo
                          http://www.exn.ca/dailyplanet/view.asp?date=3/4/2005# last article

                          I would be satisfied. Sounds neat too
                          1993 EXT. CAB, 3.4L V6 TBI, 5spd manual. Sonoma
                          1990 4Door, 3.2L V6 TBI, 5spd manual. 4X4. Trooper
                          Because... I am, CANADIAN

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            My hope in creating this post was to spark up discussion on this and perhaps other matters. I'm glad everyone who has posted thus far has put their .02 sense in. The fact is, every POV has certain inherent qualities. I know not everyone would agree with my position, and some may think I'm just listening to what I hear in the media (a.k.a. the afformentioned everyone). But when it comes to politics, I gave up on the media a long time ago. Rest assured, I have formed my opinions based on personal observatons and long, drawn out discussions with friends. I welcome opposing views on the subject, so long as they are structured and thought out.

                            I hope this thread can continue and everyone who has an opinion voices it. Who knows, you may have something to say that makes me think about changing my POV. And vice versa.
                            I may own a GTO now, but I'm still a 60V6er at heart.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              i didn't realize everyone's opinions were under such scrutiny. i personally am not agreeing or disagreeing with any1 but i am curious as to where everyone else gets their information if not from a media outlet of some sort.
                              The Official Rotating Mass Nazi

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