Turbo Project - Last Minute Questions/Advise

[Schmieder]

Alright, things are coming together. Waiting on a few items, UPS Ground, and 2' of snow isn't helping any, lol. I placed this thread in the Off-Topic section so the topic can swing about.

I still need to figure out how to use my springs in the WasteGate. I have 3 springs. It was shipped with 2 springs which are roughly 2" diameter. One obviously weaker then the other. However, there is one spring that is about 1/2" in diameter. The third spring was installed in the WasteGate. That one was the strongest. The dealer said I can get psi's of 4,5,6,8,9 and 10 psi.

So I actually have 4 springs. One would think the little spring was a mistake, but it is included in the pic from the seller.



LINK in case the pic doesn't load up.



What is that little spring for? I don't want to leave it out if it is needed to function properly. The rest of the WasteGate I figured out. It's pretty straight forward. Now, the little spring has no way to be secured inside the wastegate that I can see.

Also. I read I can safely boost up to 8psi on stock internals. Is that for a low mileage engine? Can an engine with 58k, mild abuse but no neglect handle 8 psi? It will have a tune. Not using the fuel rail pressure boost method for fuel delivery.

[robertisaar]

3 springs, 6 settings?

is it possible that it can be used in conjuction with the other springs?

[Schmieder]

3 springs, 6 settings?

is it possible that it can be used in conjuction with the other springs?

Thats what I am thinking and I'm pretty sure of. What I am really confused about is the little spring. The odd ball spring that is different then the larger 3 that was shipped.

That spring is in the product pic so it is meant for something.

Once I figure out the little spring, I am set as far as installing the wastegate is concerned.

EDIT: Getting the little odd ball spring to sit in the wastegate internal is really tough. All the others rest well and feel appropriate. But the little one can't rest well because there is a round conical object in the center. The large springs rest around it, the little one would have to rest on it but I can't get it to sit when closing it up.

If the little spring is used for boost control, then leaving it out would be ok. I am using a manual boost controller. Keeping the vacuum hose as short as possible to avoid boost spike. I learned it is better to keep the spring operating under boost leak from the BC instead of it's rating w/o BC. SO I will use the medium spring and boost controller to start.


Just as long as the little spring isn't a critical component somewhere on/in the wastegate.

[robertisaar]

could ask the seller. when i got my turbo from speedy racer, it was from Andy Wu(IIRC). he seemed to know what he was talking about.

[Schmieder]

could ask the seller. when i got my turbo from speedy racer, it was from Andy Wu(IIRC). he seemed to know what he was talking about.

You must have read my mind cause that is what I just did a few moments ago, lol.

Would you happen to know the thread size for the fuel filter?

Also, I am tapping the oil pan 1/2 NPT. I'm using an 11/16 Drill bit (size of 1/2 NPT w/o thread length). I read how some people use only JB Weld to secure the return flange. JB Weld is oil resistant, handles up to 600*F and bonds to metals very well.

Do you have any pointers in using JB Weld to back up the thread tap? Advice or things to watch out for?

[robertisaar]

anything related to JB Weld and oil can't be too good of an idea... i'd be using teflon tape before resorting to JB Weld... it's not pressurized, so the only reason it would leak is due to too much gap between the threads on the fitting and the tapped threads. if teflon tape won't seal it, you may need to do it again...

as i said already, no idea on fuel filter threads.

[Schmieder]

anything related to JB Weld and oil can't be too good of an idea... i'd be using teflon tape before resorting to JB Weld... it's not pressurized, so the only reason it would leak is due to too much gap between the threads on the fitting and the tapped threads. if teflon tape won't seal it, you may need to do it again....

Right, makes sense. I'll get some Teflon Tape tomorrow.

I actually found an 11/16" drill bit with a 3/8" shank. And I have a quality 1/2 NPT tap. People who were using the JB Weld were honda guys. I guess it is a ghetto rig. I don't want ghetto, I refuse....lol. There is a difference between ghetto and cheap.

as i said already, no idea on fuel filter threads.

Sorry, I must have over looked that. I'll swing by the hardware store and figure the thread out.

I found some fuse circuit taps and got some for the gauges. Easy link up to constant and switched power. I'm having a lot of fun building this turbo. And I bet more fun to drive it around town.

[3400beretta]

Why are you pissing around with different springs? You order the wastegate with the lowest boost that you plan on running. So if you want to run a min of 6 psi, you order it with a 6psi spring. Then you use your manual (or electronic) boost control to adjust it higher. The spring just sets your min pressure. No need to ever change it.

[IsaacHayes]

Be careful with teflon tape. I use it on coolant fittings cause that can't really clog up too bad if a piece gets in the line, but with oil and fuel lines, a tiny piece can come off the threads and then stick an injector, carburettor, oil passage, etc.

[Schmieder]

Why are you pissing around with different springs? You order the wastegate with the lowest boost that you plan on running. So if you want to run a min of 6 psi, you order it with a 6psi spring. Then you use your manual (or electronic) boost control to adjust it higher. The spring just sets your min pressure. No need to ever change it.

I like options. Besides, I ordered the Wastegate and two days later I decided to get the manual controller anyways. Reason why I am opening the wastegate is I want the weakest spring in first. Work the boost up until I hit max psi or issues with the small spring. If I have issues I can use the next spring. If a spring breaks or wears out, I have a back up. At the very least, I'll have a funky paper weight.

Be careful with teflon tape. I use it on coolant fittings cause that can't really clog up too bad if a piece gets in the line, but with oil and fuel lines, a tiny piece can come off the threads and then stick an injector, carburettor, oil passage, etc.

Good point. Is there a thread sealer that is oil/gas resistant? I imagine there is, I'll look that up. Any other sealing suggestions for the return oil flange? My basic setup is a tapped thread 1/2 NPT to a 5/8" barbed connector, using a rubber o-ring (oil and heat resistant) to help seal.

Honestly, I think my setup will seal just fine. I may be getting over board with the oil return flange.

The simplier it remains, the less chance something breaks or goes wrong.

[3400beretta]

You can use pipe dope, im sure the natural gas stuff will resist the oil just fine. Or you can just use rtv sealant, thats all I used.

A note about the o-ring. I found that because of the NPT threads, I could not tighten the fitting all the way in so the hex part is tight against the oil pan. So you may not be able to use an o-ring there.

[RedZMonte]

I know on the Tial gates you have 2 different size springs, larger boost levels on the narrower thicker springs and lower boost on the larger diamiter thinner springs.. I would just put the lowest set spring in there and use a boost controler or swap them as you need to up the boost. I also assume stacking the springs will increase the boost but dunno, maybe you just got more boost levels then advertised. My Tial gate has 1 spring in it 10PSI.

you can use JB weld to hold the oil pan return flange on, i would not recommend it because if it cracks or the surface isnt clean all the way (scraped paint and 100% clean oil pan) it could bond poorly and fall off. If that happends then your oil is just pumped out of the engine till its dry... If you are just using JBweld to seal up the hold around a threaded bung that is screwed into the oil pan it should be fine but could leak down the road (vibrations, unclean surface ect...) my honda buddies used the oil return screwed into the pan and JB welded it around the flange and worked but eventually leaked.

S

[Schmieder]

You can use pipe dope, im sure the natural gas stuff will resist the oil just fine. Or you can just use rtv sealant, thats all I used.

A note about the o-ring. I found that because of the NPT threads, I could not tighten the fitting all the way in so the hex part is tight against the oil pan. So you may not be able to use an o-ring there.

Right, I didn't think about that but I understand it completely. Maybe a few washers but, I'll think on that on, thanks.

I know on the Tial gates you have 2 different size springs, larger boost levels on the narrower thicker springs and lower boost on the larger diamiter thinner springs.. I would just put the lowest set spring in there and use a boost controler or swap them as you need to up the boost. I also assume stacking the springs will increase the boost but dunno, maybe you just got more boost levels then advertised. My Tial gate has 1 spring in it 10PSI.

you can use JB weld to hold the oil pan return flange on, i would not recommend it because if it cracks or the surface isnt clean all the way (scraped paint and 100% clean oil pan) it could bond poorly and fall off. If that happends then your oil is just pumped out of the engine till its dry... If you are just using JBweld to seal up the hold around a threaded bung that is screwed into the oil pan it should be fine but could leak down the road (vibrations, unclean surface ect...) my honda buddies used the oil return screwed into the pan and JB welded it around the flange and worked but eventually leaked.

S

Before I use any kind of back up sealer like JB, I am cleaning the surface with degreaser, grinding a rough texture to bite and then using brake cleaner for a perfectly clean aluminum surface to bond to.

I wonder if one could use fiberglass fibers mixed into the JB Weld? Anyone try that yet?


Progress note: I got some steel plate that is 3/16" thick (around 9-10 gauge) and fashioned a flange box. The box is welded to the cross-over and has a 1.5" pipe out the side for the wastegate.

I will be making my own manifold system from scratch over the next few months with the old heads and intakes as a mount. Until then, it is the cross-over and the 3/16 plate.

Got to run

I've been meaning to get some pics up but my camera card is stuck in my laptop. I have to take the thing apart to get it out. Until then, I found the USB cable and will uplaod some pics soon.

[robertisaar]

I wonder if one could use fiberglass fibers mixed into the JB Weld? Anyone try that yet?

ghetto + ghetto is still ghetto

granted, i've used bondo in places it was never designed to be used in, but i wouldn't trust it with something as important as oil...

[walterdude]

As far as the O-Ring goes,,, you DON'T want the fitting to go in that far. NPT (IIRC: NPT = National Pipe Thread) threads are tapered threads and are designed to do all of the sealing. If you use washers it will stop the threads from sealing,, as the pressure will be on the washers and NOT the threads. If you get the fitting to thread in a bit more than the thickness of the oil pan you'll be fine. If you go deeper you just make the hole bigger and the fitting will go into the oil pan further. Some kind of sealer wouldn't hurt, as long as it doesn't block the fitting or get into the oil (teflon tape). As far as drilling the hole,, for a 1/2"X14 NPT my tap/drill chart calls for a 23/32 drill.
Hope this helps..