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**ForcedFirebird** · 10-04-2007, 08:46 PM

Did you try rotating it backwards?

**geoffinbc** · 10-04-2007, 10:03 PM

Interesting. Obviously something is stuck. I would start by unbolting the torque converter and rule that out then investigate the motor. Timing chain first and then the bottom end.

**IanSzgatti** · 10-04-2007, 10:11 PM

tried rotating backwards.... will go through the usual checks if the boss and customer agree to spend the time... just wondering if any of you had an ideas as to a cause...... concidering what lead up to the failure, which by customers account, nothing, it's a doosie of a mystery...
if you want my thoughts, i'd say their son was probably the last to drive it... and I bet he tore the bark out of it... time will tell... i'll let ya know what happen to this bad boy... its a 1997 grand Marquis with a 4.6 v8

**ForcedFirebird** · 10-04-2007, 11:14 PM

Hmmm the 4.6 is a tough motor. I have one with over 187k and it's still peppy in a 98 F150. The tranny has been rebuilt twice, the first time it would stall when put in gear. I'm only slightly fimiliar with tranny internals, but he said the sprag went both times. They tend to use oil after a while, but I think mine is the valve seals because it puffs smoke after sitting for a length of time. My guess would be a tranny issue from experience with Ford always using a tranny slightly smaller than the vehicle deserves.

**sharkey** · 10-04-2007, 11:54 PM

stalling when put into gear is a lockup issue, basicly oil isnt put into the converter to hold the lockup clutch off. this can be caused by a stuck valve or bad sealing rings.

as far as a tranny locking up, i highly doubt thats the cause. first the torque converter would have to lock solid, then the geartrain would have to have blown up locking it solid. i had an f150 with a 5.4l towed into my shop and it was knocking bad, after a couple minutes of running it trying to diagnose the noise, it threw a rod. ive also heard of timing chains going and that could cause it to lock up.

**ForcedFirebird** · 10-05-2007, 12:06 AM

It's odd you mention timing chains on the Ford modulars, they have a nice tensioner on them. Unless it broke, I would doubt a timing chain issue.

Now I want to know what happens!

**sharkey** · 10-05-2007, 01:16 AM

i have heard of chains breaking. its a possibility. id still bet on a broken rod.

id pull the cam covers off to inspect the valvetrain, then pull the k-frame down and get the oil pan off. even if you do end up changing the motor, you still gotta get it to turn ot get the converter nuts off.

**IanSzgatti** · 10-05-2007, 06:20 PM

Originally posted by sharkey View Post

even if you do end up changing the motor, you still gotta get it to turn ot get the converter nuts off.

good point... didnt touch it today though, i know we here are way off base putting in thrust and tranny fluid, but i dont call the shots at my shop.. i'll suggest your ideas though after the long week-end......

**IanSzgatti** · 10-09-2007, 11:25 AM

converter nuts off... at first the TC wouldnt turn more than a little, then we got it to move... can rotate it for what seems like 360 dg, but then a solid stop. Checked.... pistons move up and down, cams seem to be turning.... probably going to have to take the trans down.... waiting for bosses aproval... possibly converter problem??

we'll see.....

**ForcedFirebird** · 10-09-2007, 12:41 PM

So my guess of tranny issues was correct? I've always had problems with Ford trans. As I mentioned earlier, the one in my truck has been rebuilt twice now. The first time it needed rebuilding it would stall as soon as put into any gear, but would start in neutral. Then all of a sudden it would run ok while driving and stall at a stop light.

**IanSzgatti** · 10-09-2007, 05:29 PM

Actually Forced it's looking like the timing chain jumped and a valve is blocking complete rotation... we're going to remove the front covers and line up the crankshaft pulley mark and check it against the cam sprockets... if this is the case, I don't expect to much damage internally as the 4.6 apparently likes to jump when you shut the engine off...
that fits with the customers story of parking the car and then 3 weeks later trying to start it only to get no crank... customer has agreed to have us go at this, so it's a rush, and a labour intensive one... lotsa shit to take off this motor.

I will definately post a fix on this though.

**ForcedFirebird** · 10-09-2007, 06:03 PM

Yes they are a PITA to work on. I have changed my plugs several times on my F150. They go straight down into the top of the manifold with about 2" of room from there to the cowl, the plug socket could actually get lost down there and I have to use a 3" extension just to barely fit the ratchet on there

.

**IanSzgatti** · 10-12-2007, 06:28 PM

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd172/Szgatti/bentrod.jpg

so this is no longer a mystery... but as to the cause, we can still only guess. customer is getting a new motor, and if I were them, I would not leave my keys with junior anymore... because we suspect he ran the bag of that 4.6 while they were on vacation...

**ForcedFirebird** · 10-12-2007, 06:53 PM

Originally posted by IanSzgatti View Post

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/d...ti/bentrod.jpg

so this is no longer a mystery... but as to the cause, we can still only guess. customer is getting a new motor, and if I were them, I would not leave my keys with junior anymore... because we suspect he ran the bag of that 4.6 while they were on vacation...

Looks like the 4.6's have forged rods, lol. If they were cast, it would have broke.

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A mystery so mysterious, it's mistifyingly

A mystery so mysterious, it's mistifyingly

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