retard timing ?

[canusa]

ok i know i know.. another timing thread. but i've searched and couldn't find any answers.

Using a dial indicator or any other method to accurately measure/mark a depth, measure from the cam flat to the bolt head holding the cam carrier to the head. It is either this method or make a cam flat tool that will hold only 1 cam at a time.
(ok so i made camflat tool that will only hold one cam at a time)

so the timing belt gets installed here.....?

When you rotate the crank over 360 degrees, the cam might still move some. You will need to hold down the intake cam still or measure it since only the exhaust will be locked down during the intake cam timing

(so i put the 1 Cam flat tool on the intake cam? and the exhaust has the lock ring in already?? or is it still freewheeling?)

Rotate the crank 360 degrees to do the front exhaust cam. Install the lock ring and then pull the cam flat tool.

(i get that part)

Rotate the crank 347 degrees (watch the timing mark) and verify the rear intake cam is flat.

(of course it's flat it still has the 1 cam hold down tool on it correct?)

Install lock ring and hold the cam gear in place with the cam gear holder. Repeat for the front intake cam.

(ok so i rotate the crank 347 degrees from that point? or from the stock timing mark again?)

Now both banks are timed and its reinstall from here.

sorry for all the questions, but i don't wanna screw this up.
please help

thanks,
-canusa

[SappySE107]

Sounds right, but you lost me on that last 347 degrees. Do the rear exhaust first, then the front intake, front exhaust, then rear intake. That is the easiest way I know for doing 1 at a time. Just make a block that sits on the cam flat, that will be flush with the cam carrier when the cam flat is perfect. Easier than measuring, and you can just use pliers to move the cam a little with the lock ring out.

[canusa]

i made a hold down tool to hold down only 1 cam at a time.. so i won't be needing that block.

and i'm lost as well. i don't know when to turn the crank, and which cams to be holding at what times

i know you gotta be pro at this by now. can you simplify that for me? or maybe just put it in your own words.. maybe a different point of view will help. thanks,

-canusa

[SappySE107]

Ok, on the 91-93, the rear cam (exhaust) is too close to the strut tower to take that pulley and lock ring out. Take all the others out. Starting with the rear bank, lock that exhaust cam to the 13 degree timing mark. I assume you know what that is. Lock ring is in, so no hold down to worry about since this is the starting point. Rear intake cam has the lock ring out, so just hold that cam down to flat and spin the crank 347 degrees to the real TDC mark. Now set the front intake cam flat and lock that one down. Advance the crank 13 degrees, and set the exhaust cam flat. I don't know how your tool works, but all you need to do is figure out how to get the cam flats up. Real easy way if the move on you too far is to just put the bolt in the cam and spin it around with the bolt. Then break it loose and pull the bolt out. Ok, all thats left is the rear intake. Real easy, front cam bank is all set with lock rings, no hold downs. Sping the crank around 347 degrees so the rear intake cam is flat with the real TDC mark.

If you haven't tried yet, just try, cause it all makes a hell of a lot more sense as you do it.

[Mitch DOHC]

so if i was going to do this without putting a new belt on my belt is farley new..... i would just set the back cams both flats up.... should be that way any way with factory timing right?????? put my locking tool on the exhast cam loosten the cam bolt.... i have a 94 so no rings... advance crank 13 degrees lock the exhast cam back down take off hold down tool....and then repet for the front

[Mitch DOHC]

that was an easy way that i cam up with doing it..... just want to see if ya think it will work befor i do it....

[SappySE107]

Yup, 94+ is much easier, especially if you dont need to pull the belt.

[Mitch DOHC]

thanks.. i will be doing that this weekend........ how lopey will my idel be...... i like lopey idels... my other car is a 1969 olds 442.... big block 400 engine.... so im use to a rough ideling car.. and actually like it that way

[canusa]

i took the lock ring off all the cams.. i removed the cam carrier to get at the rear ones.. no one told me i coudl do it any other way.

ok i'm gonna try this tonight.. and i'll let you know if i have any problems.. thank you soooo much is very much appreciated.

[SappySE107]

Well, my car doesnt lope too much, others do. I guess im used to it? hehe, its not as smooth as idle, but I dunno how much of a lope you will see.

[canusa]

ok so i think i'm done.. but just for reference sake.. when the crank is at TDC where should the cam flats be? and where should they be at the 13* mark?

thanks
-canusa

[SappySE107]

Intakes at TDC when crank is TDC. The exhausts will be 6.5 degrees behind. Move the crank to the 13 degree mark, and the exhausts will be at TDC and the intakes will be 6.5 degrees advanced.

[Zboy]

Is this timing retard something thats worthwhile on an auto Z-34? Are the tradeoffs in lowend torque worth the benefits in high end power with an auto tranny instead of a stick?

[dykz34]

For an auto, it's probably wise to not go to 13*. Something more mild would be good though, like 6-8*.

[SappySE107]

Bullshit. 6-8 is worthless, you can't even notice. The low end hit is minimal at best, unless you live at high altitude where there isn't enough pressure. I lost count of how many auto owners run 13 now and prefer it over stock.