Replace Water pump Housing

[stantmann]

Ahh man, I screwed up. Replacing water pump (my engine was cold) and I broke the lower bolt off. It is in a bad spot, this really sucks! Someone give the quick lowdown on replacing this please....
I pulled it off again, and then replaced the gasket and put some sealant on it, but I don't think it'll hold being on the bottom.
I'm gonna do it tomorrow, but wanted to know of any surprises I may possibly run into - It looks pretty in depth.

Thanks,
Dennis

[Lyle's GTP]

Assuming since you are posting here you have a DOHC. Isn't your water pump housing cast as part of the timing cover assembley. If so removing it requires a shit-storm of work. This includes removing all timing components, alternator, AC compressor, PS pump, serpentine belt/ tensioner, harmonic balancer and draining oil/coolant. The list goes on and on. Good luck. Have you considered repairing the broken bolt in the car?

Lyle

[stantmann]

Yup - still leaking.
Thanks Lyle, Looking at my spare engine, that's exactly what I was afraid of.

The bolt is onm the bottom, I'll see what I can do, but don't think it is in the right spot top drill out.

My spare only has 25K on it, I might as well put it in. Guess I'll be busy tomorrow.

[Lyle's GTP]

You know what, I've been thinking about this alot. Pull the motor, fix the bolt, then drop it back in. Doing all that timing shit in the car is just insane. I think if you compare the times it makes more sense.

Lyle

[stantmann]

Hi Lyle,

I was thinking exactly the same. Take the ac off, loosen or remove the mount bolts, then jack that side of the engine up (to get it above the space where the computer sits), then drill the bolt out, it's just so damn hard to drill from a small space, let alone sideways.

A friend of mine said to try this before ripping the engine up: Use two gaskets with sealant, what do you think?

[Lyle's GTP]

Well, if it seals, it won't last. You could try though, what's the worst that could happen? I don't know if two gaskets would help much. Just use one, but get some really good gasket maker, I personaly like Permatex "The Right Stuff" gasket maker. Pull the pump out, clean it (perfectly) with acetone maybe use some emery cloth to "rough-up" the surfaces (before you use acetone). Make sure it's perfectly dry, then put a good even quantity on both sides of the gasket bolt it in as usual. But make sure you let it cure for 24hrs before you put any coolant back in. When all that is done give it a try.

However in this situation I'm kinda thinking it would be a good idea to only use two bolts. Because that will even out the gap you will have. It should basically half it and make the seal better. The only thing is torque, I don't think that the belt tension will be an issue will breaking the bolts, but I'm not sure. If you have the ability, use the bolts that are inline with the tension (pull) of the belt or in our case (push), that will add strength. If some one else could collaberate on this issue that would be great.

Hope this helps.

Lyle

[pocket-rocket]

Why not set the ECM aside, or unhook it and pull it out completely, then remove that support bracket, and set the fuse/relay box aside? Then you have plenty of room to get a drill in there to drill that whore out and tap the hole. It isn't hard to do. We had to do the same thing to get a cam gear bolt loose. But instead of drilling it, we had to beat a smaller socket on the bolt to get it to bust loose, and needed the room to swing the hammer. So if there is enough room to swing a hammer to beat a new sized socket on a cam gear, there should be enough room to get a drill in there to drill a bolt out.

[stantmann]

I was lazy today and tried the double gasket. Didn't work as we suspected.. It did slow it down to a slight trickle, but it is probably a drive to work from leaking heavily. I'll try to put it off until next Saturday.

Pocket Rocket,
I have a 1993 Cutlass. The bottom bolt on the housing is about a half inch below the wall the ECM sits on. That's why Lyle and I were talking about lifting the engine to drill it out. If the bolt was a little larger, I might be able come up with a workaround, but with such a small bolt, it would be too easy for me to make it worse if I don't lift it up and drill/tap in square.

I'll post when it is fixed and say how I ended up doing this...

Thanks

[pocket-rocket]

I have a 91, and 92 Z34, so my frame rails run exactly in the same place yours do. It has been a while since I did the water pump on the 91, so it isn't like I remeber every detail with it like it was yesterday, which would be why I suggested that. I didn't think the bottom of the water pump sat that low in relation to the frame rail (the wall the ECM sits on).

[RacerX11]

Do you have access to an electric engraving pen? I know this sounds off-the-wall, but it has worked several times for me. If you can get enough room, to get the engraving pen onto the end of the broken bolt, you can use it to remove the bolt from the cover. You take the carbide tip of the engraver, and push it into the end of the bolt, towards the outer edge. Once it seems to dig in, put some pressure on it to dig into the bolt even more, then move the engraver so that it trys to unsrew the bolt. The vibrating tip will tend to loosen the bolt up, and you can then walk the bolt out. You will probably have to adjust the engraver so it is on its strongest setting.

I was very sceptical of this method, until I tried it. I have removed a power steering pump bolt from my head, an oil return line bolt from a turbo, and several other broken bolts with this method. An air-powered engraver works better, as it has more power, but the electric engraver works too, and they are pretty cheap and easy to buy.

From the discussion, it sounds like you may have trouble getting the engraver onto the bolt, but I would try jacking up the engine and using this method before drilling the bolt, or swapping parts.

Good luck.

Marty

[stantmann]

Marty,
An Engraver? Do you mean like a Dremel tool? That did cross my mind. I've been thinking of getting a Dremel for awhile, and if there is a chance it may work, I might as well try, better then messing everything up with a drill.
If I can get a Dremel tool with an angle, it might just work.

Thanks!

Dennis

[RacerX11]

No, not a Dremel. The engraving pens that have a sharp carbide tip that vibrates. There are some engravers that have a rotating tip, similar to a Dremel, but I don't think they will work the same. You really need the vibrating tip.

Here is a cheap one from Harbor Freight: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=46099

You can also get them at Walmart, or just about any hardware store.

Marty

[RednBlack]

Since I have seen your predicament, this may just work. Buy some 2 part epoxy, mix it and using a very small amount, glue a spare bolt to the end of the broken piece. Don't glue the broken piece to the housing though. Make sure it is very dry first, and clean with acetone or laquer thinner. Hell, we should have collaborated and fixed it while I was there. Sorry, I had my brain in my ass.

[stantmann]

Thanks Marty I'll give that a shot

RednBlackCutlass - I've heard of the Epoxy trick, I'll use the favor you owe me another day, on something more complicated then a broken bolt

:-)

[RednBlack]

If you don't get it done, give me a call. Evenings are free.